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Gentleman's Military Interest Club


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Everything posted by bigjarofwasps

  1. A bit more information has come to light. Unfortunately there is no John RATCLIFFE in the 89th but it appears there's on in the 4th. Too much of a long shot, perhaps? BUT, there is a James Phipps on the roll for the 89th, Regt.no. 1930, entitled to the Crimea medal with Sebastapol clasp. Could this be the same man? Do service papers for the army that far back still exist?
  2. .............and there was me thinking Epsom was an idyllic sleepy little place!!!!!!!! When's the next train back to Whitechapel?
  3. Very interesting!!! One wonders why they chose to incorporate the word Constabulary at all? All very misleading. That Baden Powell had a lot to answer for .
  4. Glad you found it of interest, especially as a former bobby from the patch. I have tried to research the four police officers named in the newspaper reports, although I was able to find PC 269V Joseph Russell on the 1841 census other than that I have been unable to find any service details about them, as they served too far back in the mists of time. I was however able to find this out about Epsom which might also be of interest. With the extension of the Metropolitan Police district in 1839, Epsom formed part of V or Wandsworth Division. A police document in the Office for National Statistics shows in V Division, there were six PCs living in a private house in Epsom. A Mounted Sergeant supervised Morden, North Cheam, Malden, Ewell and Epsom. Another possible line of research is with the two miscreants James Phipps and John Ratcliffe from the 89th, which I am currently looking into. With regards to the 1919 riot the Canadians were involved in a similar incident in Kinmel Camp North Wales. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7923380.stm
  5. Something that I've always found curious about the South African Constabulary is why the used the rank Trooper and not Constable? I think I'm right in thinking that they were formed as a police force to take over from the army once the war was won (and it was assumed the war would be over quickly). When this wasn't the case, their role changed to a para-military outfit. Which I assume is where the rank Trooper comes from. When the unit was first founded did they use the rank Constable? Are any medal groups know to exist, whereby a British bobby left to join the SAC and then returned to his previous role afterwards? Perhaps 1897 Jubilee Medal, Boer War Medal(s) and a 1911 medal perhaps?
  6. If I'm honest I'd never heard of this ship until the other day, when I happened to watch the first episode of a new series about it which has not long started on Sky. In the programme they claim that the ship contains $3,000,000,000 worth of 1909 gold eagle dollars. I'm curious to know why they believe that the cargo contained only newly minted 1909 double eagles as apposed to any other gold dollars that would seem to have been more readily available, also just how many 1909 gold eagles were minted, would there have been enough to provide 3 million dollars worth of coins for the ship and for general uses without these coins being super rare?
  7. I'd say with a fair element of certainty that this photo was taken in somewhere in Germany.
  8. Ladies/Gents, Can anyone tell me what medals these officers are wearing? I can make out the Golden & Diamond Jubilee Medals, but what's the black and yellow looking ribbon? Also the tall chap in the middle on the top picture appears to be wearing a Police LSGC, am I right in thinking that the RGP are awarded the same LSGC as British main land police get? Whatever the black and yellow medal is the chap third from the right appears to have a clasp on his medal? On the bottom picture the chap seated has four medals, one of which appears to be the Golden Jubilee Medal, but what are the others? The first one appears to be the Colonial Medal, do the RGP get this medal instead of the QPM? Most of these chaps appear to have more medals than the average UK bobby gets am I missing out on a collecting sphere here?
  9. No problem, sorry I couldn't tell you any more. However, this might be of interest.............. https://www.oldbaileyonline.org/browse.jsp?id=t18760529-375&div=t18760529-375&terms=William Piper#highlight Case refers to a WILLIAM PIPER (Policeman E 243), which I suspect is your chap........
  10. He appears to have joined before 1879.
  11. Couldn't find Sgt West so he must have joined before 1879. Const Henry Richards warrant number 68514, joined on the 06.08.1883 and retired on the 23.10.1907, having spent his entire service in A Division. Might be worth putting their names into the Old Bailey website, you might turn something up there......
  12. Alan, I couldn't agree more. Have PM'd you. Regards, Gordon.
  13. Ladies/Gents, I would very much like to hear other forum users views on the below two medals which sold yesterday on Ebay. The 1911 example, not an exuberant amount (£45) I'm sure you'll agree? But the 1887/97 example £310 is very concerning!! Am I missing something here? PC Saundery appears to have had an unremarkable career, spent in Y Division from 1887 to 1912, he never gave evidence at the Old Bailey (that I can find). So what is it about him that has demanded this premium and why didn't his 1911 medal command the same? You will note that the listing gives another name, but has been corrected in the item details. Even if if had been the medal to PS Elsworth again nothing overly exciting about this man he served his career in Westham and have evidence at the Old Bailey twice (nothing exciting). Interestingly his medal sold recently on Ebay as well and didn't command this high price? So Ladies & Gents, what is it I've missed or can I expect to start paying this much for 1887/97 medals from now on?
  14. Hi Alan, Welcome to the forum, VERY enligtening first thread!!! A classic example of why medals don't need to be named to H Division to have a H Division connection. I have several in my collection that fall into this catagory, but unfortunatley for me, there were all too early it have a "Ripper" connection, tenuous as that might have been. The nearest I've got is a J Division chap, he joined just before Jack and was st Bethnal Green Station most of his career, certainly during and long after Jack. It should be noted that the 42 officers were deployed for plain clothes duties, there were loads (several hundred I understand) that where posted there for uniform patrols, during the "Ripper" period. Sadly these are not as well documented, but if you happened across one documented in police orders, you'd have struck gold, I would think. What I always find interesting is the fact that so many officers H Division or otherwise were in Whitechapel at the time, yet so few of them have a documented "Ripper" connection. Although I'm sure they all have a tale to tell. Re the auction itself, I agree. This coupled with the fact that the seller clearly didn't know what he had. The most expensive H Division medal I've seen sell was a 1887 example, that went for £500 on Ebay, again no "Ripper" connection at all other than he was in H Division at the right time. MADNESS in my opinion. I'd liken it to any 1st July 1916 medal, they always demand a high premium to, I remember seeing one once on a dealers list, with a silly price. On closer examination, the chaps Regiment wasn't even involved in the Somme attack, he'd just been killed on the 1st of July, on a completely different part of the line, caveat emptor!!!!
  15. I agree Simon on both counts!! No doubt he'd have had some tales to tell about being dragged from the comforts of T Division to hunt the Ripper in Whitechapel, but these have long since been lost . At most I fear he'd only have been there a couple of months, he certainly isn't named as taking an active part in the case and if it wasn't for one entry in police orders no one would have ever known (certainly no further scope for research that I can see, unless your prepared to trawl through the police courts reports hoping to turn something up). I wonder how much PC LONG's 1887 medal for instance would fetch if that ever came on the market, I dread to think!!!!!!!
  16. CASE CLOSED - It appears that I have missed the tenuous "Ripper" connection. https://www.casebook.org/dissertations/h-division-personnel.html?printer=true But if I'm honest I wouldn't have paid £310 based purely on him being posted to Whitechapel in October 1888. If he'd have had some sort of documented roll in the case then fair enough. On the other hand the 1911 medal would have been a bargain, which I will kick myself for in due course!! On a plus note at least 1887/97 Jubilee Medals aren't suddenly demanding high prices, for that at least we can breath a sign of relief !!!
  17. This is the bidding history, there seems to have been a frenzy between 3 bidders in the last couple of seconds, I really can't understand it?
  18. Since starting this thread, I have come aware that Thomas ARNOLD of H Division fame was a veteran of the Crimean War.. He joined B Division on 19 March 1855 and resigned on 20 September 1855 to fight in the Crimean War. At the end of hostilities he rejoined the Police on 29 September 1856, being attached to K Division. So he certainly would have had both medals. Would be interesting to know which clasps he qualified for and what if any previous military service he had?
  19. Ladies/Gents, Just out of interest does anyone know whether such a medal group exists?
  20. Stumbled across this, thought it might be of interest..... Man Discovers $2.4 Million in Gold in Ex-Army Tank...A tank collector in the United Kingdom was in for a surprise when he and his mechanic opened one of his tank's diesel fuel tanks. Inside were gold bars totaling approximately $2.4 million dollars. The tank came into possession of Nick Mead, a tank collector and owner of Tanks Alot, a company that offers tanks and other armored vehicles for driving classes, private events, and television and film appearances. Mead found the tank, an ex-Iraqi Army Type 69, on sale on eBay and traded it for an Abbot self-propelled howitzer and a British Army truck. Mead and his mechanic, Todd Chamberlain, were filming the opening of the fuel tank because they had already found machine gun ammunition in the armored vehicle and wanted video proof in case more ammunition was found. They pulled out five gold bars weighing about twelve pounds worth an estimated $2.4 million. The gold was handed over to authorities, and Mead has placed a receipt for the bars of bullion in a safe deposit box. http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a26009/man-discovers-gold-in-ex-army-tank/
  21. I would assume Kilburn itself as Divisional Headquarters, as I imagine that would have been where Olive was stationed. Being the senior officer, I assume that the other officers would have come to him for the picture as apposed to him going to another station?
  22. Hi, Can anyone tell me when Supt Olive was at X Div? Judging by his photo, I think it must have been early last century, can anyone shine any light on this for me. Also included in the photo are various Chief Insps and Insps.... Sygrove Collison Whittle Ball Dingle Douglas Baxter Reid Taylor Macer Ricketts Perry Instance Dauncey Sellors Cosgrove Morgan Barrett Parker Lvie Richards. All have at least two medals each. They are all wearing peaked caps, two of them are in civvies, which look late Victorian to Pre-WW1 style. If anyone has any thoughts I`d very much like to hear from you. Gordon.
  23. bigjarofwasps

    New one Pound coin...............

    Despite what you might see on Facebook or up for auction on Ebay. Pound coins dated 2016 are NOT rare or worth thousands!!!!!!! Simply the Royal Mint started producing them last year ready for release, hence the 2016 date. I further fear that all this hype about flawed examples, will prove to be nothing exciting in the coin collecting world either. By all means sit on any examples you may have, as who knows, but don't rush out and spending your hard earned cash to buy everyone you find on Ebay, under the delusion that they'll be an investment.
  24. http://www.dailypost.co.uk/business/business-news/1-coin-your-pocket-not-12389749
  25. bigjarofwasps

    New one Pound coin...............

    Cracked, warped and missing middles: thousands of new £1 coins 'have major production flaws' http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/03/thousands-new-1-coins-have-major-flaws/