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Gentleman's Military Interest Club

Dave Danner

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Everything posted by Dave Danner

  1. I think these Württemberg versions are "sloppy" because they were simply a way of folding the ribbon for presentation, with the expectation that it would later be properly mounted on the recipient's medal bar. Dansson, you EK2 could have been to a Bulgarian as well as to a Saxon. A couple more Bulgarian examples that are even more pentagonal:
  2. There were three Bavarian units in the Ostsee-Division. • bayer. Kraftwagen-Maschinengewehr-Kompanie, zugeteilt dem Radfahr-Bataillon Nr. 5 • bayer. Feldlazarett Nr. 23 • bayer. Gebirgs-Artillerie-Abteilung Nr. 2 (bayer. Gebirgs-Kanonen-Batterie Nr. 7, bayer. Gebirgs-Kanonen-Batterie Nr. 12, bayer. Gebirgs-Batterie Nr. 8 (H))
  3. Meine Großvatersprache ist badisch. Meine Muttersprache ist Florida Cracker.
  4. King Ferdinand I's decorations

    The Iron Cross was not an "Imperial Military order", but a Prussian decoration. He received the Iron Cross 1st and 2nd Classes. From Mecklenburg-Schwerin, he received the Military Merit Cross 1st and 2nd Classes. He probably received the 1st Class of the Oldenburg Friedrich August Cross as well as the 2nd Class, but I don't see it in any of the photos in this thread and the rolls of the cross are not published, so I cannot confirm. From Schaumburg-Lippe, he received the Cross for Loyal Service (Kreuz für Treue Dienste), both on the ribbon and as a pinback cross (Steckkreuz). This is the 10th medal on the medal bar with German decorations in the first post. Boris and Kyrill both received the version on the ribbon. All three awards were on 28.4.1916. The 15th medal on the medal bar with German decorations is the General Honor Decoration "For Bravery" (Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen "Für Tapferkeit") from the Grand Duchy of Hesse (Hessen-Darmstadt).
  5. Here are a couple of Württemberg examples. Many Bulgarian awards seem to fit your description as well. Some examples: Here is a similar Saxon mounting from a Straube catalog: And a more straighforward trifold. It basically depends on where you fold it.
  6. Légion d'honneur

    Alexander, the July Monarchy (Monarchie de Juillet) was the period from 1830 to 1848 when France was a constitutional monarchy. Given the age, and the tendency of the enamel on this order to break easily, the example you show is in very good shape. You can see some examples of different versions here: http://www.cndp.fr/crdp-reims/ressources/dossiers/legiondhonneur/panneau8ter/panneau8ter.htm
  7. Precedence is wrong (KVK2X and Ostmedaille outrank Landesorden). Ehrenkreuz für Frontkämpfer should be there. I don't like it.
  8. Not to my knowledge. These ranks received either the Tapferkeitsmedaille or the Verdienstkreuz am Bande der Tapferkeitsmedaille. I don't have them at hand, but I believe the Militärverdienstkreuz statutes specify "wirkliche Offiziere". I could be wrong, though.
  9. The seller has two sets, one for 750 euros and one for 890. Given the price difference, I would make sure to check there is not a quality issue before going after the cheaper set.
  10. He received the SA3bX on 22.12.1914 as an Oberleutnant in Reserve-Infanterie-Regiment Nr. 102. He received the SA3aX on 17.1.1917 as a Hauptmann in Reserve-Jäger-Bataillon Nr. 12. He does not appear in any casualty lists, so no birthplace through that source. He was promoted to Fähnrich on 21.12.1906 in IR 178 and Leutnant on 19.8.1907 (Pat. 19.2.06), so he was probably born around 1888.
  11. ARAB MEDALS -- Morocco

    Order of Ouissam Alaouite A new addition. I once owned a Grand Cross set of this order, which ranks among the many "I wish I hadn't had to sell that" sales I've had over the years.
  12. I don't have any further detail on his military career, but here is the bio from his doctoral dissertation:
  13. I think there are too many possibilities, and too many have only a last name in the rolls. So it would be hard to say for certain.
  14. Under normal circumstances, I would agree. The KO3X is, as I noted, rather uncommon. And as I also noted, with a clip-on medal bar, medals can be easily removed. However, all four clips for the first four decorations are at the same height. If second place was for an HOH3X, the clip should be higher to account for the crown. It's not 100% either way, but the KO3X does fit. Also, the overwhelming majority of RAO4/HOH3X/DA recipients are known to have at least one Landesorden from another state besides Prussia. And that is even with all of the missing rolls, including those of several larger states such as Hamburg and Hessen. So, while the number of KO3X awards is small, so too is the number of known RAO4/HOH3X/DA combinations without a non-Prussian decoration.
  15. Hi again, Yes that is reasonably likely scenario for the bar with the Bavarian order. However, there were plenty of awards of the Bavarian Military Merit Order with Swords to non-Bavarians and to Bavarians in the navy. So while it was most likely a Bavarian lieutenant, it could also have been a Prussian lieutenant in a unit like Infanterie-Regiment König Ludwig III. von Bayern (2. Niederschlesisches) Nr. 47. For the Wehrmacht Dienstauszeichung, the 4th Class here required at least four years' service. The next grade required at least 12 years' service. There was no double counting of wartime service, as with Prussian long service awards. The Wehrmacht Dienstauszeichung was first awarded on 2 October 1936 and awards were made until WW2 broke out in September 1939. So we know he was active between those dates, but cannot say for certain when he returned to active duty. The typical case was a wartime volunteer in 1914, commissioned as a Leutnant (der Reserve) during the war and released from service when the Imperial Army was drawn down between 1918 and 1920. As the Reichswehr/Wehrmacht was expanded beginning in 1934, many of these former officers were recalled, often as supplementary officers (Ergänzungsoffiziere). The typical former Leutnant was recalled as a Hauptmann (E). Since they usually only had 4-5 years of service in the Imperial Army, and less than 5 years' service in the Wehrmacht (1934/5-1939), they did not reach the 12-year threshold for the Wehrmacht Dienstauszeichung 3.Klasse. During the war, they might have advanced as far as Oberst. There were of course, exceptions, but this is a typical case. Many E-officers were only active in service on the homefront, so they may have only received a Kriegsverdienstkreuz 2.Klasse mit Schwertern during the war. They also may not have had an opportunity during the war to wear a full medal bar, so never bothered to upgrade the medal bar with any wartime awards.
  16. Hi and welcome to the forum. Assuming the medal bar has not been tampered with, and the correct medals are there (with clips, obviously, medals can be switched out), the bar most likely fits field-grade officer (Major/Oberstleutnant/Oberst) who was retired during the war. The Crown Order 3rd Class with Swords (KO3X) was not a common award. Before World War I, it might have been awarded for China or colonial service to a senior field-grade officer, but in that case there would be a campaign medal (China, Southwest Africa or Colonial) on the bar. During World War I, the Order of the Red Eagle and the Crown Order were not commonly awarded in the lower grades, since the Iron Cross filled the role these orders did in the colonial wars. However, there were a number of awards, mostly to officers forced to retire or placed zur Disposition for various reasons. If these officers already had a Red Eagle 4th Class, the next decoration in the normal peacetime progression was the Crown Order 3rd Class. Since these officers had been at the front, in their case it was awarded with swords on the black-white ribbon. Other officers who retired during the war, but who had served in the Heimat, such as Wehrbezirk officers, might receive the order on the normal blue ribbon. As noted, there weren't many awards during the war. In the Militär-Wochenblatt, there were 51 KO3Xs gazetted (also 1 award of swords to a prewar KO3). The small number makes sense, since few officers retired during the war, since there was, of course, a war on. Those that did were usually forced to retire due to invalidity, in which case if they had enough service a decoration was appropriate, or due to incompetence, in which case no decoration was appropriate. Do you have a better picture of the medal bar? What is after the Ehrenlegion Medal?
  17. Pfretzschner. Are you sure about the rank? In April 1873, Eduard Pfretzschner was a Rittmeister in the 4. Chevaulegers-Regiment. He was promoted to Major on 1 May 1873. He was retired sometime around 1875/76 and given the Charakter as Oberstlieutenant a.D. on 24 March 1885. He died on 7 March 1890 in München.
  18. Thanks. That loop that looks like a tilde is apparently that mark in handwriting to distinguish a "u" from an "n". We're also lucky that the rank was Premierlieutenant, since that rank was Germanicized in 1899 or so to Oberleutnant. The DR 22 Stammliste came out in 1898, so he pretty much had to be in it. In a weird coincidence, given my typo above, I just came across a typo in the 1916 Saxon Militärverordnungsblatt where IR 178 was listed as IR 148. My typo makes sense, since 4 is next to 7 on the keypad on the side of my keyboard, but I would think the MVB was typeset.
  19. Typo, should be 1843. That's pretty much all there is in the Stammliste. It does not even say which regiment he was in before DR 22. He was a Prussian, not a Badener, and did not start out with the regiment. However, after a little further digging, I found that he got his EK2 as a SekLt. in Ulanen-Regt. Nr. 8. The UR 8 Stammliste adds a bit more information:
  20. There is no von Lancken in the DR 22 Stammliste. It appears to be, rather, Ernst v. Saucken, *8.1.1873 in Elkinehlen bei Targutschen, †1.12.1883 in Karlsruhe. Prem.Lt.in DR 22 on 19.3.1872, promoted to Rittmeister on 9.7.1878, and retired on 16.11.1882.
  21. August was promoted to Oberstleutnant on 1.3.15 and Oberst on 26.6.17. According to the 1916 k.u.k. Rangliste, Friedrich was promoted to Major on 1.8.14. He is not listed in the 1918 Rangliste. He may have been a casualty, but only about 10% of the k.u.k. Verlustlisten have been transcribed online. Josef (4.8.1875-10.4.1943) was promoted to Major on 1.1.18, so he seems to be the likely candidate. He was an Oberst (1.6.24) in the Bundesheer and retired as a Titular-Generalmajor on 23.4.28 (is "Tit." the Austrian equivalent to "Char."?).
  22. RIR 221 and RIR 222 were Großherzoglich hessische Regiments, which would fit with the Kriegerehrenzeichen in Eisen which he is wearing. It looks like "221" on the shoulder boards.
  23. OK, here is what Virtuti pro Patria says: