drspeck

Dear Utku, Welcome to the forum ?? You know that collections do not have to follow a pattern? Although I have a focus on particular items, there is a certain chaos in my collection to. I also love to pick up the items I like which do not necessarily fit my collection If your fun comes from picking up the pieces you like I can only advice you to buy the items you like and love. If you do want to specialise in a certain subject, might I suggest you to find any reference books on the subject matter to start with. I do not have any examples for you, but maybe other forum members know which books to look for? Best regards, Peter

Gentlemen, I bear good news, I have found our man, and it was in the end thanks to the QSA. Some days ago I reached out to David Biggins, the owner of the Anglo Boer War forum. He was not only kindly enough to reply to my email but also send me the original listing of the auction of the full sized medal bar of Adolphus of Teck - please see attached. The listing gives the exact 6 QSA clasps which are also on the miniature medal bar. My first thought was, what are the odds of finding someone else, my second thought was, if there is a listing of the full sized medal bar, maybe somewhere in the recesses of the internet there may also be a past auction listing of the miniature medal bar to Adolphus... and that's what I found - please see the other attachment. Listing 801, catalogue no. 36, as sold by Morton and Eden in 2008. The original catalogue can be found on the Morton and Eden website under 'past auctions'. This off course still leaves us with the question, where is the Order of the Bath? Best, Peter

Dear all, thank you all for the excellent additional information A late 1930's date sounds logical given the information as presented here and the fact that the bar does look like a German style bar. At least I now know what the first ribbon represents and how this curious combination of ribbons might have come to be I'll add a note with this information to the bar

Many thanks that volunteer cross makes it an interesting combo ?

There is a nice article on the eid mar coins on the following website: http://www.thehistoryblog.com/archives/59762 If you're interested in archaeology, this is by the way a really nice website. It usually has a new article every day on a current archaeological topic. Best, Peter

With German ribbon bars, you see personal prefences play a role in what is displayed or not. Does that also happen in British bars? The only Fitzclarence who could qualify is Aubrey FitzClarence, 4th Earl of Munster (1862–1928), but he held the office of Gentleman Usher-in-Ordinary to Queen Victoria from 1885 to 1901 and to King Edward VII from 23 July 1901 until 7 February 1902, so at least no QSA, but also no other mention of awards.

Paul, you are right. His wiki page states his GCB was a Knight Grand Cross. I am not familiar with the rules in the UK concerning how orders can be worn, but would he have been allowed to wear his Grand Cross as a (miniature) medal? By the way, this is a cropped pre-ww1 image of him (looks just before ww1) with all his orders up to that point. Best, Peter

Laurentius, thank you for your comments. It's a very good observation. It means a possible candidate must be a very strong match. Talking about candidates, in the past few days I have been searching for possible candidates. I checked all the male participants of the British Royal Family who were present as Royal Guests at the Jubilee celebration of 1887 (wiki), that is the ones that are mentioned ?. Next I did a cross reference with the recipients of the Royal Victorian Order (wiki), that is the ones that can be found via the lists on wikipedia ?. I filtered out all persons with 1) different orders and medal and 2) with dates of death prior to around 1917/1918 (because of the ww1 medals) or after 1932 (because of the check by Paul on the Order of Leopold). Based on the available information I can find only one name: Prince Adolphus, Duke of Teck (wiki) He makes for a compelling candidate: - Photos picture him with the Order of St Michael and St George, the QSA with 6 clasps and the jubilee medal with 1897 clasp. Recipient of the Royal Victorian Order. - Military attache at the British embassy in Vienna, which could explain the Order of St Michael and St George. - His wikipedia page states he received the Belgian Order of Leopold, French Croix de Guerre and French Legion of Honneur - Died 1927 Would be awesome if based on this name the QSA clasps could be matched (or not ?, which would mean I have to start over ?). Are there QSA sources where a name can be checked and/or does someone has access to such a source? Best, Peter

Paul, thanks for checking I will assume a date of death prio to 1932.

Paul, if you have the opportunity, please do check for the order of Leopold. In the meantime, I'll go through the list of royal guests at the golden jubilee (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Jubilee_of_Queen_Victoria). Thanks, Peter

Dear all, I've been looking at the lists of the recipients of the Royal Victorian order on Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Victorian_Order) and I can find only 3 possible matches, 3 princes. Do we know if these lists on Wikipedia are complete? Also, is there anywhere, a source and/or a website, where I can get the 6 clasp QSA checked out? Is for example the angloboerwar.com website a place to post this bar? Best, Peter

Dear all, This part of GMIC is new to me, so please be gentle with me ? I’d like to show you my first British piece I recently picked up at auction, and came in today. It is a nice unnamed miniature medal bar. Although my main interest is German ribbon bars, I do also have pieces from other countries, mainly mainland Europe. As an addition, I have been looking for a nice British miniature medal bar for some time now. I have a bit of a soft spot for the Victorian period so I looked for a piece with at least something from that period, and that’s how I bumped into this piece. Also, the gold 1887 jubilee medal with gold 1897 clasp makes me think this might be royal family, which was also a reason for me to go for this piece. Heavy wear on the back. It looks time period to me but my experience with British pieces is limited so would also like to hear from others. Also, based on the 1887 medal and 1897 clasp, might this be identifiable? Best, Peter

Daniel, that's very cool many thanks It's a real coincidence, I've been an amateur archeologist for over 25 years... very cool to read about his archaeological exploits

Dear all, Please see the attached photo’s. A recently received Austrian ribbon bar that came from auction. All parts are UV negative. I’m looking to identify the first ribbon which has me stumped. The pink threading on the back could make you believe the first ribbon might have been changed but the pink threading runs actually all the way round – the red color of the backing makes the pink appear more red -, so the first ribbon appears to be an original addition. Anyone any idea? Also, the last ribbon is folded a couple of times, but looks to be something Romanian. All help appreciated ?? Regards, Peter

Dear all, Please see the attached photo’s. A recently received Bavarian ribbon bar picked up at auction. All parts are UV negative. Paul C. already had a look at it and did a quick check for a name but was not able to find one, so I’m posting it here for additional help. All help much appreciated ?? Best, Peter

Hi. The wreaths on ribbons 2 and 5 look original to me. Some of my bars also have these. They can be found in plain and in enameled condition. Nice uniform set up by the way, must have taken a lot of time and work to assemble ?? Best, Peter

Hi. Could you show the entire bar back and front? This device does not scare me by the way although it is a bit crude and rarely seen - I've only seen one other example in the past years. Patina and wear look o.k. to me. For me ribbon bars are as much about variation as they are about following regulation. Best, Peter

Laurentius, It helps, thanks for the extra info Best, Peter

Daniel, That's a low number, thanks for the info Best, Peter

Dear all, I picked up this small trapezoid bar some time ago, which has: - RAO3 with bow and crown - Long service cross - Centenary medal There is not much to go on here, but I found this old thread from Rick explaining a few things: https://gmic.co.uk/gallery/image/977-bow-tie-prussian-red-eagle-order-3rd-class/ Based on the thread a few questions: - Because of the bow this person had already received the 4th class? - 3rd class would normally mean a full colonel? - The bar does not have a Crown order 3rd class. If I assume correctly on the thread than this guy was a major general whose crown order, to quote Rick, "[...] had "moved on and up" to a commander grade"? What would the naval equivalent be? And does anyone also have the award numbers for this combination? Best, Peter

Pierce, I will. Are there any other sources besides the ranklist to check? Andreas, the Verdienstmedaille is also something to check. It is one of the orders in the 1925 ranklist so I will also check the ranklist for this combo. Good suggestions

Dear all, I have this ribbon bar with an MMJO, which came from Zeige some time ago. I haven been looking for this recipient ever since. I recently picked up a copy of the 1925 Ranklist. Assuming the golden eagles represent continuous service since 1918 and ribbon 4 represents the OM3K (Militärverdienstkreuz mit Kriegsdekoration ), I figured our guy could and should be found in the 1925 ranklist. After going through the 1925 ranklist -twice- I found two names with the exact combination (BMJ3/BM4x/OM3K): Ritter von Thoma Ritter von Weber My most important questions would be, are my assumptions correct and could I have missed anyone? Best, Peter

Thnx

Thanks, this explains why I could not connect these to the ribbon bar

Dear all, With the kind help from Daniel Krause and Paul Chepurko this bar has been identified to be from Generalleutnant Heinrich Schëuch (Charakter als General der Infanterie). His bio and promotions can be found here: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinrich_Schëuch https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinrich_Scheuch He can be found in the 1914 rank list on page 8 as Director of the central department (Zentral-Departement) of the War Ministry. He was one of the last ministers of war of Prussia. In the attachment his 1914 rank list entry. I'm not yet proficiant in this but I'll give it a try - these are the orders from his 1914 rank list entry (please correct me if I'm incorrect or add info if/where necessary): - Prussia Red eagle order 3rd class with bow and crown - Prussia Crownorder 3rd class - Prussia Long service cross - Baden Order of Berthold 3rd class (BBi.3) - Baden Zahringer lion 3rd class with oakleaves (BZ3bmE) - Bavaria Order of Michael 3rd class (BM3) - Bavaria Military merit cross 3rd class (BMV3) - Lippe House order 2nd class (LDH2) - Mecklenburg Order of the Griffin 2nd class (MG2b) - Saxon Order of Albrecht 3rd class (SA3) - Wurttemberg Order of the Crown 2nd class (WK2c) - Bulgaria Order of Alexander 3rd class (BA3) - Japan Order of the sacred treasure 3rd class (JZ3) (Orden des Heiligen Schatzes - Zuihosho) - Austria Order of the Iron Crown 2nd class (OEK2) - Romania Star of Romania 3rd class (RumSt3) - Sweden Order of the Sword 2nd class (SS2b) There must be reasons why some of these do not show up on this post-1918 ribbon bar: - The Red Eagle order is not on this bar; was it upgraded to a cross to be worn around the neck? And hence is not showing on this bar? - Was the Crown order upgraded with swords? - Either the Order of Berthold or the Lippe House order was a cross, not a medal (one of these is not on this bar). Can anyone confirm? - Was the order of the griffin an officers cross? - Was the order of Albrecht upgraded with swords? - Was teh Wurttemberg Order of the Crown upgraded with swords? Please add information if available. Best, Peter