Gordon Williamson Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 From the smallest ( barring stickpins) for the buttonhole - and note the "female" style ribbon !, to the largest, the Grosskreuz.From 14mm and 2 gr, - to 63.5mm and 55gr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 3, 2005 Author Share Posted August 3, 2005 GKs have some very distinctive features, quite apart from the dipping eye. Note the very "flat" top to the beading ribs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 3, 2005 Author Share Posted August 3, 2005 And the beautifully finished outer corners, none of the cross over # effect fround on Junker RKs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biro Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 (edited) Hello GordonSorry - I'm a little confused by the reference to Juncker RK in the post above.....You posted this GK in an S&L thread the other day....is this an S&L GK??Marshall Edited August 3, 2005 by Biro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 3, 2005 Author Share Posted August 3, 2005 Hi Marshall,It was only shown with the S&L RK for size comparison, and the reference to the Junker RK is simply in regard to the fact that whoever cut the tooling which gave the beading the # effect on the Junker RK didn't exactly cover himself with glory in terms of being a master craftsman when you look at what could be achieved.As for this one, it matches the one in Geissler Page 254. which is believed NOT to be Juncker.Interestingly, the tiny 800 mark is typical of Steinhauer though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 (edited) Here's the little one, unfortunately ( ) not a single pin.Dietrich Edited August 3, 2005 by Dietrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Just for interest, here is Souvals postwar Grand CRoss copy. Rather well done, complete with acid frosted inner frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Reverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Souval's GK had a low swastika, with clear "pyramidal" sides, and a different "cut" to the frame corner beading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Souval also has a substantially thicker "eye" with smaller diameter hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Maybe it's of interest to post the L/12 800 GC I have currently for Study reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 reverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 The lower ring portion and the marking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Williamson Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Very interesting Dietrich. The one you have and mine share many frame characteristics, but the numerals are very different.Given that Herr Escher was given the task of cutting all the original 1939 Iron Cross dies, it makes sense that S&L must have had the full range made, from EK2 up to GK, although it has been suggested that Juncker alone were given the contract to supply the PK (though I have never seen documented evidence of this).There are several aspects of the GK I have that suggest "S&L" to me ( the tiny 800 which was an S&L characteristic, the use of Rhodium plating visible on the flat outer frame -also found on early S&L pieces, etc) Also, the existence of the original GK die frame tooling in the Ordensmuseum in L?denscheid which I suspect was donated by S&L.I have seen a GK in the normal blue covered GK case in the style used for the RK of the KVK (unlike the red case with gold eagle used on the very first awards of the RK and the first GK to HG) which matched this possible "S&L" GK and was allegedly part of the Klessheim hoard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 As you surely know ( ) this cross is from Klessheim. Let me try to compare the corners..Dietrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brian von Etzel Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 As you surely know ( ) this cross is from Klessheim. Let me try to compare the corners..Dietrich←Purported to be or we "surely know"??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 Brian,from all I know it came from Klessheim. But I was not there picking it on my own, true! So there's always a certain level of "believe it or not". However, it seems to be a genuine Juncker.Dietrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brian von Etzel Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 (edited) Thank you Dietrich, I would have to say when it's original and beautiful as that one is, the story just sort of 'fits'. Thank you so much for having the reputation you do to be trusted with this piece and be given the opportunity to share what you could. It's a great benefit to all of us.The piece of the puzzle missing from my knowledge base is what makes a wartime issue Juncker on original dies different from a postwar Juncker made on original dies as related by the late Mr. Stump. Edited August 7, 2005 by Brian von Etzel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 Brian,yes, that is a puzzle that might be impossible to solve. IF the story if post war restrikes is true and 'they' made them in the same quality as pre-war, how could one ever know?The first order of business in this case really would be to find out whether Bills' story is true. But how could that be done? We might never find out!Dietrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dietrich Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 Gordon,here's the comparison. Not the same.Dietrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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