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Luftmensch

Turkish Pilots Badge variations

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Tim,

Thank you very much. I bought it as original but not at any fantastic price ( I can't remember but it wasn't really high) and had always wondered. I agree that it is not officer grade and probably an issue one due to it being made from such thin brass. I have had it about 7-8 years and if they had been faking them, I would think some would have come to light by now.

Dan Murphy

Edited by Daniel Murphy

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I suppose that this is a civilian pilot's badge? Notice that the "TC" on the cartouche of the badge is the same as that at the top of the document and the picture of the badge on the document. No military motifs on the document either. Very interesting.

Chip

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This thread has produced a lot of fascinating stuff for me, especially as I never spent much time studying Turkish Republic badges. This is clearly modeled after a WW1 pilot's badge, and the inscription at the top of the badge where the tughra would have been says "TC (Turkish Republic) - In memory of 10 years".

Taken by itself, I would have thought the badge was simply a one-off, but the document tells a much bigger story. The document is a graduation diploma from the Eskişehir aviation school. What they have done in this case is scratch out the usual wording and written in that this is a special award in recognition of 10 years' service, to a "Tecnik?i" or technician, who probably was an employee of the aviation school. That confirms that the badge is probably one of a kind.

But that's not all! The badge depicted on the diploma is - one would presume - something that was awarded to graduates of the aviation school. Obviously it is also modeled after the Ottoman pilot's badge, but with the foundation date of the empire removed, and the "TC" or Turkish Republic cypher added at the top. This confirms that such badges were used by the Republic after 1928.

So the badge that Steve French sent me photos of (which I posted on this thread back in January) probably was a transitional Turkish Republic pilot badge dating from some time between the establishment of the Republic in 1923 and the change to Latin writing at the end of 1928.

Tim

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Here is the exact translation :

Pilotluk derecesi/piloting degree: -

Rasitlik derecesi/aviation degree:-

Teknik derecesi/ytechnical degree: 1

Diplom No: 1270

A Diplom to a flyer graduated from school of Aviation

Name: Kof

This diplom is presented for the 10th Anniversary of Turkish Republic.

Issued in Eskisehir.

Nota: This is not a military diplom. A tecnicer diplom of Turkish Aviation Assosiation widely known as Turk Kusu. (Turkish Bird)

Photo of Turkish war pilot of Gallipol, Lt. Cemal Durusoy 1914

2nd image: Lt. Ali Riza Bey War pilot of gallipoliOn 20th November 1915 Lt. Ali Riza and 2nd Lt. Ibrahim Orhan (flying an Albatros C1) shot down a French plane over Kabatepe during the battles of Gallipoli. This is the first time in history that a plane is shot down by another plane. Let me give you some information about Ibrahim Orhan Bey.

Galatasaray is familiar to all with the football club rather than the Lycee/Highschool in Istanbul. Galatasaray Football Team won the European Championship 3 years ago. On the other hand during the WW1 many students or graduants of the Lyceum didn't hesitate to join the army as reserve officers. Many of them killed in various fronts.

Ibrahim Orhan Bey graduated in 1912. He was the grandchild of Sadullah Pasha and son of Dr. Sadik Bey. He volunterede to Turkish Air Force and became a war pilot. During the flights over Gelibolu he was wounded 2 times. In 1916 his plane crusted to sea near the island Semadirek. He is the first Turkish airman who killed in action. May Allah keep him in his paradise. Allah rahmet eylesin! Dilerim ki oyle olsun!

Please note that there is no history without Turks.

Edited by Tosun Saral

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Tim, doesn't the Steve French badge have the same maker mark as the badge posted by Gor?

Very observant! Yes, it does appear that the little "E" (or whatever it is) is a maker's mark, and both of these transitional post-WW1 badges have the same maker! Cool!

Tim

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I don't know where I copied this picture of a pilot but he has the Turkish War Medal, pilot badge, pilot insignia, a bar and belt buckle.

Demir

Edited by demir

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Gentlemen,

These Meybauer marked badges that are common on the auction market are post 1945. There is a pre-1945 "period" Meybauer Ottoman Flyer's Badge, it holds to strict Meybauer criteria. If you learn and know their German Army and Naval Flight Badges as well as their TWMs, ICs etc you will have your answers. Don't try and force and square peg in a round hole.

The Ottoman Cast badge that is in this thread from a certain dealer(s), I have hand inspected it, is from another false line don't touch them. There is certain criteria on the Ottoman badges as well.

News at 11 as Volume II, like Volume I goes deep on this ...... coming later this year

Respectfully

Panda

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Hi,

May I ask a favour gentlemen?

Will you please post the early pictures which are missing now, again.

I know it is a burden but, please!

Best wishes

Demir

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Yes, Paul Meybauer Berlin did make an Ottoman Flyer's Badge. It is of the style that the Police Officer is wearing in the picture. The * Firm also made a variation but has an enamel Tughra which is OK on some European made badges but NEVER on the cast Ottoman style badges, NEVER.

I have inspected countless collections and have only seen, so far, one correct Meybauer Ottoman Flyer's Badge. It is not the badge that you see in mass quantities some marked with the Meybauer Crest and others not, but all die-struck from the die. They are all the same badges with different cosmetics and with the same wrong pin. Like the badge pictured on this thread with the same bad pin as the fake cast Ottoman badges with enamel tughras.

I will fully develop in Volume II coming soon, but please avoid those badges !!!

Panda

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I want to post this vary nice picture of an unknown ottoman officer with pilot badge. This picture was taken in germany at the RFA 501 (giant plane unit).

Regards

Alex

Edited by jaba1914

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Here my contribution.

Maybe someone can identify the clasp on the ribbon for the TWM.

Regards

Alex

Edited by jaba1914

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Another picture of an german (saxon) officer with the ottoman aviation badge.

Taken 1918 at FEA 4.

Regards

Alex

Edited by jaba1914

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