Republic of Ireland Irish 1916-20

[Phill]

The Irish Independent of Tuesday April 23, 1935 has a photo with the caption;

"President De Valera inspecting the firing party of 1916 men before the unveiling of the Memorial in the G.P.O." The firing party looks quite like the guys in that photo. The only thing about that doesn't add up about this guess is that some of the men in the 1935 firing party photo are wearing 1916 armbands and I can't see any in the photo under discussion. You can read about the GPO unveiling if you search on the Irish Times website (www.irishtimes.ie), for the 23rd/4/1935 and use DeValera as the keyword but the Independent website doesn't seem to have the same feature (www.independent.ie)

If I had to guess at the location where the photo was taken I'd say that it looks like Gardiner Street, (but it could be somewhere else long since demolished), if it is Gardiner Street another guess is that it may be connected with the unveiling of the memorial to the 2nd Battalion Dublin Brigade which is at the rear of the Custom House. I've seen photos taken at the unveiling of that statue and the firing party then was made up of similarly kitted out men.

Molders, thanks for the reply, but how do you go about finding it on the Irish Times website, as I can?t seem to get to it, or is it a subscription, please perhaps just a few tips,

Phill & Phyllis

[Irish1916]

Gentlemen, I would be interested in your thoughts on the lower case font used on this officially named and numbered War of Independence medal presently for sale. I was only aware of the use of Upper Case.(Apologies for the poor picture quality)

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[Paul L Murphy]

I have 1054 Thomas Walsh which is a medal with Comhrac bar that came from the family and is named in lower case with initial capitals.

[Irish1916]

I have 1054 Thomas Walsh which is a medal with Comhrac bar that came from the family and is named in lower case with initial capitals.

Thanks Paul, that a definitive clarification of the official use of the lower case font. Perhaps someday I might get to grips with the official markings.

[hijc4]

[Hi there, My name is Joe and am new to this forum so excue me if this is the wrong area or this. I have a small collection of medals I have been asked to sell, 2 independence with bar they are a brother and sisters, a 1966 rising medal and an emergency, 2 1/2 boxes and a document with a small ribbon in it (not 100% sure what it was awarded with) I know the recepient and have some details. I have missed the recent auctions and would like them to go to a good collector can you suggest a good course of action or even a value,

many thanks for time

regards

Joe

[Ulsterman]

1. scan medals and pics.

2. post here.

3. please add details of recipients

4. Word will get out after we discuss the medals

then-either sell by private sale, eBay (world wide audience) or go to one of the well-reputed auction houses (pay commission).

Thank-

[hijc4]

Thanks Ulsterman

here are the pics of the medal. I will post the names and details after I speak with my dad so they are right.

[hijc4]

and the doc

[Kev in Deva]

Dear hijc4,

Welcome to the Forum / Cead Mile Failte,

not to be a pain, but if possible please post pictures of the items,

front and rear, close up

the reason for asking is there are known fake items out there

and the more evidence that you can show that your items are original,

will result in more interest and better offers on your items.

Kevin in Deva. :beer:

Edited May 6, 2009 by Kev in Deva

[hijc4]

Go raibh maith agat a cara

i will get close ups of the medals back and front asap

[hijc4]

ok here we go pics of the medals 1 of the 2 indep / emergy / 1966 / I thought it prudent having read your posts to put a copyright strip on the images so they are not copyed. I have a as you can see from the last post a douc that was awarded with one of the medals and also a copy of the family bible that lists the names and birth dates of the 2 recipents,

take a look let me know what your thoughts , thanks for your time

Joe

[hijc4]

1966 medal

[hijc4]

emergency medal

these medals have not been shown in over 30 years and are in perfect condition. the boxes are shabby however. They where given to my grandfather by the recipent and then went to my dad and now they are with me. it would be great for them to have a good home where the history can be preserved.

thanks again , a greatful visitor to your forum

[Irish1916]

Gentlemen, I pointed a 1916 veterans' descendent in the direction of the GMIC to further his research and he has posted a new topic in this forum. I am aware that this particular topic is "watched" by a lot of interested persons and am thus taking the liberty of highlighting here, his new topic "1916 ICA Action". Regards Paul.

[PatC]

It is my Wife?s Granddad who is in the picture he is directly behind the front Mans left shoulder, his name Ellett Elmes he passed away in 1958, so unfortunately cannot be the 66 celebrations.

He is named in the reference book, Frongoch: University of Revolution by Sean O' Mahony, words from the book as follows

He is named on Page 46 as one of the Protestants in Frongoch. He is also mentioned on page 123:

"The British now tried a new scheme whereby prisoners were offered conditional offers of liberty which meant that they would be released if they signed a written guarantee that they would keep the peace. Of the 600 remaining prisoners, only 3 opted for this. The first was an Irish Citizen Army man, Ellett Elmes, who signed the approved undertaking on the 24 October and further a bond in the amount of ?25 was executed by a Church of Ireland Minister, Rev E H Lews-Crosby, from Rathmines on his behalf."

His Brother in Law Henry Coyle, F Company, 2nd Battalion, Dublin Brigade, was 28 years of age. He was a well-known member of the Davis Hurling team. He was mortally wounded in Moore Lane, and died in the arms of the O'Rahilly. He left a widow. His baby boy was born after his death and named Henry O'Rahilly Coyle. He is buried in Glasnevin Cemetery, Dublin. http://nga.ie/new_page_2.htm

Any more help would be greatfull

Phill

[Irish1916]

Phil, i am in discussions with Henry Coyle's granson, whoes father is mentioned above, do you know him or want to contact him yourself, Paul

[PatC]

Hello Phill,

This is my first visit to this site and I have just seen your posting of 29/1/2009. The Henry Coyle you mention was my grandfather. He was killed during the evacuation of the GPO and his son (my father) was born three months later. There is a photo of my grandmother and my father as a baby in The Catholic Bulletin which listed biographies of all the Volunteers who were killed in action during the Rising. Can you please explain the marriage relationship between my grandfather and your wife's grandfather? I have been looking at the Dublin census of 1911 and as far as I can trace, the Elmes and Coyle families both resided at 8 Rutland St. Upper in 1911. My grandfather and his family and your grandfather in law and his family both appear to have been residing at 32 Leinster Avenue at the time of the Rising. At some time after the Rising, your grandfather in law appears to have moved to 2 Eglington Terrace. My grandfather had been killed in the Rising but his younger brother Thomas (who also fought in 1916 in the City Hall Garrison, was subsequently interned in Frongoch and later fought in the Civil War) was living a few doors away at 5 Eglington Terrace. I would love to hear from you.

Regards,

PatC

[gerardkenny]

Just read this thread now and have to say it's one of the most interesting threads I have read on any militaria forum. Splitting groups like that is horrific, words fail.

[gerardkenny]

Here is another interesting set of 1916 medals on ebay with a starting bid of €8,000.00 to a man who apparently fought in Boland's mills. There is no mention of provenance with it other than 'name revealed to buyer'

http://cgi.ebay.ie/w...em=130427604950

The above collection of Medals are being Auctioned as a Job lot and will not be split, they were left to me by a deceased Grand Uncle who fought in the 1916 Easter Rising in Dublin, all these Medals are genuine and NOT FAKES,

The collection consists of The 1916 Easter Rsing Medal, the Black and Tans 1922 Medal with a comrac Bar (combatant), and the 1939-47 Emergency Medal, My Grand Uncle took part in the Easter Rising in Bolands Mills, he took part in the Irish Civil war 1922 and later joined the Free State Forces.

The 1916 Easter Rising Medal is in superb Condition, likewise its Green and Orange ribbon and its clasp.

The 1922 Black and Tans Medal is also in superb condition, it has the Comrac (combatant bar on it) the Ribbon bears some age but is in very very good condition.

The Emergency Medal 1939-47 Medal also in excellent condition and has its clasp attratched.

None of the above Medals were ever polished or engraved, i will disclose to the winner, my Great uncles Name,,.

Good luck in the Bidding, Thank You.

[irishmedals]

Here is another interesting set of 1916 medals on ebay with a starting bid of 8,000.00 to a man who apparently fought in Boland's mills. There is no mention of provenance with it other than 'name revealed to buyer'

http://cgi.ebay.ie/w...em=130427604950

After a quick look, all 3 medals certainly look genuine with nice patina. The 1916 medal also has the older and thiner top suspender bar but a rather tatty ribbon. I personally don't mind if ribbons are tatty as it adds a bit of personality and originality.

Pity the seller hasn't used the word 'Irish' in the item heading as it would attract more bidders who search for Irish Medals.

€8000......interesting starting price! too high maybe?

[gerardkenny]

After a quick look, all 3 medals certainly look genuine with nice patina. The 1916 medal also has the older and thiner top suspender bar but a rather tatty ribbon. I personally don't mind if ribbons are tatty as it adds a bit of personality and originality.

Pity the seller hasn't used the word 'Irish' in the item heading as it would attract more bidders who search for Irish Medals.

€8000......interesting starting price! too high maybe?

I think the seller may have heard you as it's now been reduced to €7,000.00

[eirman]

I got these from my grandfather over 30 years ago. Strangely they came in an original 1916 box - not in the picture but someone with a 1916 medal and no box might appreciate it.

So I have ....

1916 Box

An Independence war combatants medal

Some unknown ribbons

Old Fianna Membership tag (signed & numbered on the back)

An Ireland shaped Irish Volunteer medal/badge - similar to the button badges (cannot find one like this anywhere on the web)

I.N.F.B.S, Membership badge ..... I've no idea what this is.

I'd appreciate if someone could ID the unknown items and give approximate values for as many items as you can.

I'm thinking of unloading them .... Should I sell them privately, put them up on Whytes next auction or wait till 1915 ?

HI-RES PICTURE HERE

Edited November 12, 2010 by eirman

[kapten_windu]

Who is the seller?

he just think about money and money!:violent:

[eirman]

Who is the seller?

he just think about money and money!

I am the seller.

I really can't understand your response. There is nothing wrong with selling them for money.

I'm not a collector or historian. I've looked at them about once every 8 years ... usually when moving house!

[Paul L Murphy]

I got these from my grandfather over 30 years ago. Strangely they came in an original 1916 box - not in the picture but someone with a 1916 medal and no box might appreciate it.

So I have ....

1916 Box

An Independence war combatants medal

Some unknown ribbons

Old Fianna Membership tag (signed & numbered on the back)

An Ireland shaped Irish Volunteer medal/badge - similar to the button badges (cannot find one like this anywhere on the web)

I.N.F.B.S, Membership badge ..... I've no idea what this is.

I'd appreciate if someone could ID the unknown items and give approximate values for as many items as you can.

I'm thinking of unloading them .... Should I sell them privately, put them up on Whytes next auction or wait till 1915 ?

HI-RES PICTURE HERE

My advice would be to put them into an auction since it is very difficult to value these. The ribbons are for the 1916 Medal and the 1917-21 Medal. The 1917-21 medal without bar (what you have) is about EUR250 at the moment from the last few I have seen. The badges, however, are very difficult to value.

You could try sticking the lot into ebay as well, with good photos. If you can get some of the original pension documents which confirm the recipients name it would add a lot more collector's interest (including myself !).

Best of luck and let us know what you decide to do.

Paul