NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 I've done a bit of research on some of the uniforms I own and have ordered research on them. Being that they are all HSUs, I haven't ordered the award card. While this has saved me a good bit of dough, I don't have the award numbers unfortunately!Anyway, I thought that you all might appreciate seeing some of these award citations. Due to the physical size of the citations and in trying to keep them readable (and downloadable!) I've only posted just the text itself, but will try to post some pertainent info that goes along with each. Also, given that my Russian skills are okay, but not great, I haven't translated these. After all, I can't make it too easy on everyone! Seriously, I have to pay to get the translations done right and I just haven't been able to spend the cash to get them done. So... Time for some fun! Hope you all enjoy these!Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 So here's the first one. Not really spectacular, but still... Like I've said in a previous post, you knew you were cool in the USSR when you got your own Ukaz. Sooo... Here's the Ukaz (no citation, this was all there was!) for the second HSU title to MSU Voroshilov! This was awarded on 22 February 1968. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) That was all there was to Voroshilov (unfortunately!) Even paying "extra", that's all that came out of the archives citation-wise. Next, we've got some of the citations to General Colonel Ivan Ilyich Ludnikov. Quite a fellow, ended up as an HSU with 3 Lenins, 4 Red Banners, 3 Suvorov 1st Class, Suvorov 2nd, and Bodgan Khmelnitsky 2nd. Not a bad final tally!First, let's start with one of his Red Banners, downgraded from a long service Lenin. This one was awarded on 3 November 1944 and was Red Banner "3" number 155. At the time of this award, he was serving as the Commander of the 39th Army. The author of this citation was General of the Army Chernyakhovskii. Edited October 14, 2005 by NavyFCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) And another Lenin to General Ludnikov. This guy was awarded on 21 February 1945 and was Order of Lenin number 25554. At the time, he was serving as Commander of the 39th Army on the 3rd Belorussian Front. Edited October 14, 2005 by NavyFCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) Here's another Lenin to General Ludnikov, while he was serving as Commander of the 138th Red Banner Rifle Division. This one was dated 22 February 1943 and he was awarded Lenin number 12704. The writer of the citation was none other than General-Lieutenant Chuikov! Edited October 14, 2005 by NavyFCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 Here's a Red Banner to General Ludnikov. He earned this serving as the Commander of the 15th Rifle Corps, 13th Army. It was awarded on 27 August 1943, and was Red Banner "2", number 3958. The author of this citation was General Lieutenant Pukhov, and the final approving authority was General of the Army Rokossovski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 Here's one you don't see every day. The citation for a Bogdan Khmelnitsky 2nd Class, awarded to General Ludnikov while he was Commander of the 15th Rifle Corps on 10 January 1944. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 Here's Ludnikov's Hero of the USSR citation. Nothing like you'll see for a mere mortal soldier (which normally run at least a full page) or better yet a pilot (average of two to three pages!) this one is quite short and to the point. He was awarded the title on 16 October 1943, recommended for it by General of the Army Rokossovski. At this time, General Ludnikov was in command of the 15th Rifle Corps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 Here's Ludnikov's last award, Red Banner "5" number 354, awarded 22 February 1968. He was serving as Chief of the Faculty at the General Staff Academy at the time of awarding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 That's all for now. I wouldn't want to get on folks' bad sides by making a huge thread right off. I have more citations, for Generals Luchinsky and Obukhov if you'd like to see them. Enjoy!Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) Thanks, Dave. Just wish I could read Russian!!!!!!!!!!!! Edited October 14, 2005 by Ed_Haynes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 The "short answer" is that these were all given for wartime "command and control," crediting the commander with every enemy soldier killed, gun captured, and kilometer advanced. Not unlike most countries, I suppose. Those 1968s are WOEFULLY inappropriate and completely contrary to existing regulations-- a "Hero" and Red Banner forStill Breathing. JUBILEE "Heroes!" It makes one appreciate what the Toiling Masses of the International Proletariat had to do to EARN their hard wrung decorations out of the system!Now, as a Long Answer, here is number 9 above. I can read Russian just fine, when typed like this. It's the scribbles on mottled decaying handwritten paper with parts off the edges of the copies and Cryptic Abbreviations that do me in! AND transcribing my jotted translation scribbles onto my woefully bad typing. Judge for yourselves:"Colonel General Lyodnikov, I. I. has served in the armed forces since 1917. Active participant in the Civil War.In the Patriotic War with German-fascist Germany {{{hey, I just translate, I didnt WRITE it! }} and Imperialist Japan he commanded a division in the Stalingrad battles and then a Corps and Army.In the pre-war years he was employed in the office of commander of forces in the army, District and commander of the Central Officers "Vystrel" courses. Since 1963 {{{hopping around chronologically }} with success commanded separate Academy faculties, in which he taught higher military cadres of the armies of socialist and friendly countries. The attending staffs received the highest grades in studies. Com. Lyodnikov, I. I. took an active part in the party-political life of the Academy.As an active participant in military activities in defense of the USSR in achieving results in readiness qualifications of military cadres, Com. Lyodnikov, I. I. deserves to be awarded the Order of the Red Banner."Or in short...he was Still Breathing!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steen Ammentorp Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Interesting info Dave,I was wondering whether your material includes any information on what tank brigade Obukhov commanded 1941-42. Also does it mention which Tank Army he was the assistant commander of in 1943?Kind RegardsSteen AmmentorpThe Generals of World War II Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 I was wondering whether your material includes any information on what tank brigade Obukhov commanded 1941-42. Also does it mention which Tank Army he was the assistant commander of in 1943?Steen-I believe I have at least one or two long service citations to Obukhov with his service history. I'll check when I get home today and post it if I have one.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 15, 2005 Author Share Posted October 15, 2005 Steen-Here's Obukov's service history through December 1944 (the date of the award that this citation is for.) I believe this should help! If anyone would like to see more of Obukhov, let me know and I'll post his citations.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 February-October 1941 Commander-Commissar of 26th Tank DivisionOctober to December 1941 in medical treatment for wounds at city of Ku(black off scan edge)December 1941 to December 1942 "Substitute" General Inspector Cavalry (black off edge of scan) Red Army, Substitute in command of 4th Guards Tank ArmyJanuary 1943 Commander of 3rd Guards Mechanized "Stalingradsky" Corps, 1st Baltic Front Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steen Ammentorp Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 (edited) Thanks Dave (and Rick )According to this he did not command a tank brigade December 1940 ? March 1941, but stayed in command of Borisovsk Cavalry (later Tank School) February 1941. While I have the same postings I am a bit puzzled by the dates. This states that Obukhov became commander of III Guards Mechanized Corps in January 1943. However all other sources I have seen says that Major-General Sharagin became commander of the Corps in January 1943 and that Obukhov first became commander on 4th of May 1943. So my question is how trustworthy is these service records? I have no experience with this.Kind RegardsSteen AmmentorpThe Generals of World War II Edited October 16, 2005 by Steen Ammentorp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 What Dave posted looks like a wartime positions list, not the lined "card" service record used after the war. For junior officers these wartime ones seem often sloppy and incomplete-- and appear to be tossed into their files as "junk" paper, too good to throw away, but no real use and replaced by more thorough versions.But this looks like a very neat, tidy version, with no gaps in the service times. I don't know what "Substitute" means, since I have never encountered that in a Soviet record before (and ONE YEAR seems like a loooooong time to be a "temporary/acting replacement"!), but this looks extremely accurate to me...maybe the OTHER General's record is inaccurate!!! This stuff is a bottomless pit, once we fall into it all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 16, 2005 Author Share Posted October 16, 2005 Steen-I'd say that this is about as accurate as you'll find. This was for one of his wartime (1944) long-service awards, and chances are that his service (at least since the beginning of the War) would be well known as a matter of record. Could you imagine being the officer writing this up and messing up the general's service history? I would feel comfortable putting faith in this record.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 16, 2005 Author Share Posted October 16, 2005 (edited) Looking at this again, I think this is as good as you'll get... For one, the author of the citation was none other than Commander of Mechanized Forces of the 1st PreBaltic Front, General Lieutenant Skornyakov and second, the next line below the service history is the one that states basically that his record of service has been verified and is correct, signed by the Chief of Administration of the Mechanized Forces of the Front, a Lt. Colonel Vasiliev. The final awarding authority for this award was none other than General of the Army Bagramyan! If all of them are wrong, I'd be pretty surprised! NOW, with that said... Pull out his previous (August 1944) long service award citation and it has him taking command of the 3rd Guards Mechanized Corps in April 1943. Interestingly, he left his previous command as Deputy Commander of the 4th Tank Army in December 1942, thus leaving a four month gap in his records. Since these records were intended to document ALL time spent in the military (including leave time, hospital time, training time, etc.) I am thinking that the earlier document was probably incorrect, and the later citation with the January 1943 date was probably right. Dave Edited October 16, 2005 by NavyFCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steen Ammentorp Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 Once again thank you Dave and Rick,I don't know quite what to think of this. While I think that Dave's points is very valid but it leaves me with an uneasy feeling because it would leave Sharagin completely out of the list of commanders of III Guard Mech Corps. I have seen too many sources claiming his command just to be able to ignore it See i.e. these online sources:http://mechcorps.rkka.ru/files/mechcorps/p.../biograf_sh.htmhttp://militera.lib.ru/h/liberation/index.html See CCCP sectionhttp://www.rkka.ru/handbook/corps/s_kor_k.htm?off=kf3It is of course possible that they all use the same wrong source but somehow I doubt it. I guess that the only way I will know for sure is to get hold of the war diary of the III Guard Mech Corps Kind RegardsSteen AmmentorpThe Generals of World War II Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted October 16, 2005 Author Share Posted October 16, 2005 Steen-Yeah, it is a bit confusing. There COULD be a typo on one of the citations... The only way to truly figure it out would be to get Obukov's service history which HE verified and signed (vice the Chief of Admin) which would then be the nail in the coffin for me. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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