Robert Noss Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 The best photo from todays fleamarketDated 1941Nice clear shot.Kind regardsRobert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 :Cat-Scratch: Bavarian Military Merit CRoss X, then an Austro-Hungarian KARL TROOP CROSS before his Hindenburg CRoss....!!!! Weird WW1 career as an enlistede man on loan to the Hapsburgs!!! But WAS he in forestry? FRom the tabs and stringy shoulder cords, I think some sort of Sonderf?hrer.But that CLOSED COLLAR tunic! It is not the M1943 that could be worn open or closed-- it looks like a fire/police one-- 8 buttons on front.Will send for Weird Luftwaffe reinforcements! :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 (edited) Feuerschutz Luftgaukommandolike Unterbrandmeister? Edited May 31, 2009 by Naxos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nesredep Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 Hello!Interesting Photo,new for me. All the best Nesredep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulsterman Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 ...but an HK WITHOUT an X, but he has a Karl Truppen kreuz? Did it fall off?what are the last three: Luitpold jubilee, Tyrol and Bav. LS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 I'd say its the "Christmas 1918" royalist medal on the jubilee medal ribbon, then, ayuh--Tyrol, and finally Bulgarian WW1 Commemorative. No swords on Hindenburg, indeed. A very strange career. :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Noss Posted June 1, 2009 Author Share Posted June 1, 2009 You are probably right and he is not Forestry.This small group of photos of another man with same insignia but different tunic was in my "forestry box" so it misleaded me............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Noss Posted June 1, 2009 Author Share Posted June 1, 2009 ............So what are they ?Maybe just "normal" Luftwaffe officials in the administration ?Kind regardsRobert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulsterman Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Wasn't there an obscure Luftwaffe Forestry dept at some point? No, not kidding...it rings a bell from the distant past.I still think the last ribbon is a Bav. LS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 VERY interesting-- Fliegerbluse... "flying firemen?" :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 (edited) Wasn't there an obscure Luftwaffe Forestry dept at some point? No, not kidding...it rings a bell from the distant past.I still think the last ribbon is a Bav. LS.Ulsterman,You are correct. The Luftwaffe had their own Forestry Sections. They wore Luftwaffe uniforms with Forestry ranks. They were responible for forestry management on Luftwaffe facilities. Herman also has a small separate forestry section at his residence, hunting lodge etc. They wore Luftwaffe uniforms as well but were not really part of the Luftwaffe Forestry Service. FYI-There was also a Heer Forestry Service. Their task was to look after forestry management on Heer property.Here is a photo of Herman's private forestry group blowing their forestry horns.Regards,Gordon Edited June 3, 2009 by Gordon Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 The best photo from todays fleamarketDated 1941Nice clear shot.Kind regardsRobertI would say that this appears to be a Wartime official in the rank of Oberfeldwebel. My reference for this is the photo below from page 48 of John R. Angolia & Adolf Schicht's book "Uniforms and Traditions of the Luftwaffe" Volume 2.Regards,Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Feuerschutz Luftgaukommandolike Unterbrandmeister?That is my thought, for the first photo. In 1944, members of the Luftwaffe Fire Dept(uniformed civilians) were allowed to become legitimate officials. This is the first such uniform I have ever seen! These men did not fly, but they were attached to Luftwaffe facilities. Notice that the uniform is the basic uniform for the LW FD(except for the visor, which was altered by the placement of regular LW cocade and eagle), with the old collar tabs and shoulder straps removed and the Sonderfuhrer types placed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 This is a LW Sonderfuhrer Level G(same as Feldwebel)., Medium Level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Luftwaffe Administration Official, Medium Level, Oberfeldwebel equivalent. The exact speciality and rank terminology is unknown because the nebenfarbe(color of the center layer of the shoulder board) is unknown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrier Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_06_2009/post-2778-1244173656.jpgGreat photos here and thanks for sharing them! There are many strange Luftwaffe related uniforms. Here is a Luftwaffe cufftitle I have had for years and which I have always felt was related to the quasi-military security services used by the Luftwaffe for some airbase security work. I believe a photo exists in one of the reference books of one of these fellows in a uniform very similar to the one in the photo which started this post. He wears a cap like the fire service cap, but with a Luftwaffe style wreath without wings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_06_2009/post-2778-1244173656.jpgGreat photos here and thanks for sharing them! There are many strange Luftwaffe related uniforms. Here is a Luftwaffe cufftitle I have had for years and which I have always felt was related to the quasi-military security services used by the Luftwaffe for some airbase security work. I believe a photo exists in one of the reference books of one of these fellows in a uniform very similar to the one in the photo which started this post. He wears a cap like the fire service cap, but with a Luftwaffe style wreath without wings.Wachinstitut is contracted private security Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Wachinstitut is contracted private securityNow that is cool!!! I have never heard of this firm. Do you have any information on this organization? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Gentlemen,Interesting photos of a very confusing subject. Paul,On the last two fotos you posted you say they are both medium level (career) officials. There is considerable difference between the piping on the collar tabs and on the tunics in these two pictures. Does that relate to different time periods or to different functions for the officials? Great photos by the way.Regards,Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leigh kitchen Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Wasn't there an obscure Luftwaffe Forestry dept at some point? No, not kidding...it rings a bell from the distant past...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrier Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Wachinstitut is contracted private securityThank, Naxos! In this case, I believe, the Luftwaffe version of "rent-a-cop"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_06_2009/post-2778-1244173656.jpgGreat photos here and thanks for sharing them! There are many strange Luftwaffe related uniforms. Here is a Luftwaffe cufftitle I have had for years and which I have always felt was related to the quasi-military security services used by the Luftwaffe for some airbase security work. I believe a photo exists in one of the reference books of one of these fellows in a uniform very similar to the one in the photo which started this post. He wears a cap like the fire service cap, but with a Luftwaffe style wreath without wings.Harrier,I've gone through my Luftwaffe reference books and didn't find any pictures of this cuff band in wear or any mention of it. That only proves that I didn't find it though. The only thing I did find was an armband for "Doormen and Guards of other Commands" which reads 'Luftfahrtverwaltung". This was actually an armband rather than a cuffband. It was worn with a grey uniform at the RLM and other Headquarter establishments.Regards,Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrier Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I will try to find the photo I mentioned, which unfortunately does not show the title, but refers to the individual as a type of security guard.This title is constructed exactly like a Luftwaffe unit cufftitle, with the same lettering, embroidery style, cloth and thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 (edited) It is not Luftwaffe. Therefore Gordon couldn't find it. A non-scientific institute, called Gewerbliches Institut*, implies a civilian service provider. Wach = Guard / Security Institut = service providerMy theory: It must be some transitional occurrence were private security personnel adopted by the Luftwaffe retained their civilian Armband for a while.* Gewerbliche Institute Auch viele privatwirtschaftliche Unternehmen f?hren die Bezeichnung Institut. Vorwiegend handelt es sich um Dienstleistungsanbieter, deren Kunden besonderen Wert auf Seriosit?t legen.Have a look at the link below: The sender of the 1934 postcard is a Wach-Institut owned by Willy Sch?nhoff in L?bau, Saxony. They offer Sicherheitsdienste (private security services) and Heimschutz (home invasion protection).http://cgi.ebay.fr/Lobau-Postkarte-Wach-In...emZ370186718435 Edited June 5, 2009 by Naxos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrier Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 This is very good information and makes a lot of sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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