Signalcorps45 Posted December 27, 2009 Share Posted December 27, 2009 Hello to all! I am looking for information on this medal bar. The ribbons on the bar are almost half the size of a normal ribbons. The medals seem to be normal size. I quess I am trying to find out the story behind this bar. Any information would be helpful. Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted December 27, 2009 Author Share Posted December 27, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted December 27, 2009 Author Share Posted December 27, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted December 27, 2009 Share Posted December 27, 2009 (edited) Just a thrifty (Cheap ) Bavarian. Don't know what metal the "gum drop" is made out of, but shiny and silver looking suggests NOT the early cast iron horrors, so either the 1922-28 zinky version or the 1928-36 "argentan" alloy one--design remained the same, just varied in quality of the manufacture. The ribbon indicates volunteer fire service rather than professional fireman duty. Edited December 27, 2009 by Rick Research Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott P Posted December 27, 2009 Share Posted December 27, 2009 (edited) I like anything bavarian, nice 2 piece geussing civilian bar, would still like to have it, not everyone can afford the big bars Edited December 27, 2009 by Scott P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 Rick and Scott, I paid I think $30 for this bar, so I didn't think there was a high monetary value to it. I thought it is interesting because, as Scott states, it appeared to be a civilian medal bar. I thought there may be an interesting story behind it. Rick - I did not know this maybe a volunteer Bavarian fire service medal, thanks for the information. Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militaria0815 Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 The Bavarian 25 years long service medal was awarded 360.000 times between 1920 and 1936. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted December 30, 2009 Author Share Posted December 30, 2009 militaria0815, Thank you for the info. Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyanacek Posted January 1, 2010 Share Posted January 1, 2010 Just a thrifty (Cheap ) Bavarian. Don't know what metal the "gum drop" is made out of, but shiny and silver looking suggests NOT the early cast iron horrors, so either the 1922-28 zinky version or the 1928-36 "argentan" alloy one--design remained the same, just varied in quality of the manufacture. The ribbon indicates volunteer fire service rather than professional fireman duty. I never realized that the blue & white striped ribbon was an indication of volunteer fire service. Was the crimson-colored ribbon (like seen on the 40-Year Service Medal below) used for regular/professional fire service? Best regards, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militaria0815 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Red ribbons were for professional fire men. Most bigger towns in Bavaria had professional fire briagdes, in small towns were (semi-) volunteer fire brigades which means that young man had to join these brigades, otherwise they had to pay kind of special tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireMedals Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Red ribbons were for professional fire men. Most bigger towns in Bavaria had professional fire briagdes, in small towns were (semi-) volunteer fire brigades which means that young man had to join these brigades, otherwise they had to pay kind of special tax. The idea that the red ribbon on this medal was for career firemen is new to me. I've never seen it in 40 years of collecting fire awards, and even authors, like Gert Efler who wrote the book on German fire awards, puts the grey and white striped ribbon on the 25 year service and the carmine on the 40 year service. With my very limited command of the German language, it also appears the awards were issued for service in fire brigades, without any division between just volunteer or career. Not to sound critical of anyone elses comments, but I would really like to have the source of this for my records. FireMedals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytop Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 (edited) Hi, we have in Bavaria in that time two different oval medals. 1. Feuerwehrehrenzeichen für hervorragende Leistungen (for outstanding performance/excellent achievement) http://www.feuerwehr...isch/10205.html 2. Feuerwehrehrenzeichen für 25/40jährige Dienstzeit (for long service 25/40 years) http://www.feuerwehr...isch/10202.html http://www.feuerwehr...isch/10203.html For the first medal with the text ""FÜR HERVORRAGENDE LEISTUNGEN IM FEUERWEHR-DIENST" it is correct with the different colours for professionals in red and for volunteers in white and blue. For the second medal with the text "FÜR 25/40 JÄHRIGE DIENST-ZEIT" it is for the differentiation between 25 (white and blue) and 40 years (red) of service. Uwe Edited January 2, 2010 by speedytop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireMedals Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Uwe, Thank you for all that information. This should answer any questions about this award for a long time to come. FireMedals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted January 3, 2010 Author Share Posted January 3, 2010 Uwe, Thank you for your help. Your information should clear up any confusion. Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyanacek Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Uwe, Thank you for all that information. This should answer any questions about this award for a long time to come. FireMedals Yes indeed! Thank you, Uwe, for all that great information and the links too. Very informative. Best regards, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) The blue and white striped ribbon is from the original Royal version, the M1884-1918 worn as a brooch similar to the way military long service awards for enlisted ranks were worn at the time. This was given ONLY to volunteer firemen. See von Hessenthal and Schreiber, "Die tragbaren Ehrenzeichen des Deutschen Reiches." I have the April 1940 edition. The horrid cast iron "camel droppings" of 1920-22 introduced the red = 40, blue and white = 25 In 1922 the cast iron was replaced by a "war alloy" zink but the design remained the same. In 1928 the medals were made in much better alloys but still the same horrible design, continuing to be awarded until 1936. Here is the rack of an ancient volunteer super-hero from Nuremburg circa 1933 or so with ALL the versions being worn among a variety of other decorations for lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng fire service-- Note that he had 25 years of volunteer service in by 1918--M1884 brooch closest to buttons, is wearing THREE of the ghastly camel droppings medals AND a cross with that design in the center mingled with his other awards-- including a Prussian (!) WW1 War Effort Cross near the end of his vast medal bar. Edited January 3, 2010 by Rick Research Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted January 3, 2010 Author Share Posted January 3, 2010 Rick, Thank you for providing more information. Nice pic too. Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytop Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Here are three of my medals, see the different helmet style: Uwe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted January 4, 2010 Author Share Posted January 4, 2010 speedytop, It appears that the two sets of medals on the left have a helmet that comes to more of a smooth point in the middle. The 40 year medal has more of gently rolling middle. The 25 year medal I posted looks like it has the same more gently rolling middle, like the 40 year you posted. Is this due to changes in the medal over the years? Were there specific years for each way? Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytop Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 Hi Dean, the first edition (blackened iron) had been awarded in the period 1920-1922. My two grey/black medals (patinated zinc) are from the period 1922-1928, second edition. The other four medals (silvered/gilded) in this thread are from the period 1928-1936, third edition, now with a changed helmet design. Uwe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted January 4, 2010 Author Share Posted January 4, 2010 Uwe, So the medal I have posted was issued between 1928 and 1936. It appears to have the new helmet design. Thank you for the information, I never noticed the different helmet designs. Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militaria0815 Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 There is no proof for a helmet design change in the statues. About half a million medals were made in different materials by different makers. This is the only admissable expalanation one can have for differences in helmet type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signalcorps45 Posted January 5, 2010 Author Share Posted January 5, 2010 militaria0815, That makes sense because of the different manufacturers. Thanks Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytop Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 Hi militaria0815, can you please show us medals, model 1 (blackened iron) and/or model 2 (patinated zinc), with the helmet design shown in Post 1 and 9? No matter, a temporal delimitation is always possible with the help of the different materials, see Post 20. Uwe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
militaria0815 Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 Hi militaria0815, can you please show us medals, model 1 (blackened iron) and/or model 2 (patinated zinc), with the helmet design shown in Post 1 and 9? No matter, a temporal delimitation is always possible with the help of the different materials, see Post 20. Uwe Uwe, sorry but I have not made pics of all the Bavarian firemen medals I owned in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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