Jump to content
Gentleman's Military Interest Club
misiu

Medal Bar / Frackspange with Finnish Liberty Cross 1918

Recommended Posts

Hello collector-friends,

in this case my research know-how was not for use.

Maybe someone out there is able to identify the former owner.

Regards

Detlef

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow , Fantastic Spange , Great find Detlef , I have about 70 names on holders of Liberty Cross 3rd class 1918 but this is not any of them.

What is the award between Hamburg HK and Albert Order ? This one should be possible to find I think .

I haven´t got verified numbers of 3rd class to Germans , but I promise you. There is not many of them,,,,,,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi guys,

it is indeed a Schaumburg-Lippe Hausorden Kreuz 4.Klasse (OEK 1217).

Regards

Detlef

Yes -Schaumburg-Lippe

Can we see the back of the bar and some close-ups too?

Thank you for showing it.

Edited by Claudius

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will provide with pleasure some more pictures and still hope that the brave soldier will be identified.

Regards

Detlef

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I keep coming back to look at the bar, it is most perplexing. There are most non-combattant awards, but you have the EK2 and Hindenburg with swords. There is not long service so he had less than 10 year in service. My guess on the war is that you have someone who was not in the army or navy but was connected with it or the goverment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

An active Prussian officer would receive his first and only long service award after 25, not 10 years of service. The three peace time orders are lowest ranks, given to Leutnants/Oberleutnants.

I could not find him, but my guess is active Prussian army junior officer in pre-WW1 time; probably a civilian in WW2.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

An active Prussian officer would receive his first and only long service award after 25, not 10 years of service. The three peace time orders are lowest ranks, given to Leutnants/Oberleutnants.

I could not find him, but my guess is active Prussian army junior officer in pre-WW1 time; probably a civilian in WW2.

Yes the 3 pease time awards are for lower rank, but to have received those 3 awards he should have been somebody special. If that is the case then why did he only receive an HH during the war. I would expect him to have more wartine awards if he was in service. If he was in the army a look through the 1914 rangliste should turn him up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes the 3 pease time awards are for lower rank, but to have received those 3 awards he should have been somebody special. If that is the case then why did he only receive an HH during the war.

I don't know the reason, but take a look at e.g. Werner Frhr. von Froben, who just got an Zähringer in WW1 - but had four pre-war orders on his medal bar.

If he was in the army a look through the 1914 rangliste should turn him up.

It should, yes, unless he left sevice for any reason before to be re-called in WW1... I could not find him immediately in 1914... =(

Edited by saschaw

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What is also interesting the the absence of the 1897 centennial medal. If he is an active officer, which I think he is since he does not have an LD2, he would have come in after 1897.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do not know if it helps to identify, but besides the medal bar the miniatyre chain, the ribbon bar as well as the so-called "Knopflochdekoration" exist. At the moment unfortunately no pics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is an exceptionally ODD combination, out of anything remotely correct precedence--in WW2!

Blacklight the ribbons to make sure none of the white glos electric blue. I am very dubious about this one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the VERY small world that centers around GMIC, I have a scan saved from 25 January 2010 (posted by our webr55) of this.... "set" sold then by Kai Winkler--but I cannot find it HERE again by any form of searching however we then discussed it.

With 99.99% certainty this is a Frankenstein assemblage and the ribbons will probably glow.

The awards simply make no sense together. A Leutnant with THREE peacetime Orders, unrelated to each other, at least TWO of which would have had to have been awarded after the May 1914 Rank List and before the war started? And THEN that officer, still only an Oberleutnant, gets the Finnish FOURTH Class? But our super-achiever YOUNG Oberleutnant aD is a CIVILIAN in WW2.... wearing his medals completely contrary to Third Reich rules?

I'm still searching for that old thread

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, couldn't find it-- but here is the scan I saved at the time (25.01.10) when the "set" was sold by Kai Winkler--

This should have been an early warning of "industrial scale production" by a NEW busy Frankenstein, but this occurred just as I was going offline for 3+ years so am still woefully behind on events of 2010-2013 in collecting badness.

There is always a .01% chance that something bizarre is, freakishly, actually ORIGINAL, if bizarre....but not in this case. Not without the award documents to "explain" it all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No Third Reich Treudienst--and way too many peacetime Orders. The lower the rank, the less likely to be rewarded--everywhere, every time. Weimar didn't care about rules, but this unhappy... abundance.... defies Third Reich rigidity, as well as the impossible combination.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Someone told me once the name Julius Terberger, but I could not find him?

Could this guy be real and therefore also the medal bar?

Best regards

Detlef

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interestingly enough, there was a Hptm. Ludwig Terberger in IR 158 in 1914. His awards in May 1914 were LDH4 SA3b. His date of rank as a Leutn. was 18.10.1897, so no centenary.

Perhaps the plot thickens??

Andy

Edited by arb

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×