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Graf

FAKE BULGARIAN ORDERS ON THE MARKET

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Graf   

Dear members,

Till very recently we have enjoyed fake free market..bad news is not any more

I just want to alert the Forum that for a quite a while I have noticed some increase of Fake Bulgarian Orders on the Market

The most faked one is Order of St Alexander Also faked pieces of high Classes of the Other Ordes have been on the Market, Some single fakes of rare Bulgarian medals as well

Be alert

Most of them I have noticed are on EBay, however some of them are now surfacing on different dealers sites and also on different Auctions in Europe. The source of some of them is also a Dealer in France, who is offering them to other dealers

I am trying to gather some information and at this stage I will not publish any pictures or names not to offend any pesons.

My advice at this stage Buyer Be Aware

Look for any alterations/modifications, changed parts,new parts ,fake enamel, faked patina, wrong size, bad craftsmanship etc. The most important -the quality is not as good as the original period Decorations

Ask questions, ask for more information..if in doubt pass it on

Use a common sense and your knowledge and do not jump to any deal because is too good

THe Good News is that these fakes are mainly high classess -Bad news is they are expensive for fakes.

I am expecting any one who notices any such a piece to alert the Forum

We have to try to stop such a practice and protect ourselfs

Graf

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922F   

Thank you, Graf! Interested members may wish to look at page 3 of GMIC thread: Bulgarian Order of St Alexander -Two Variatians? A very brief discussion of some apparently altered/modified Bulgarian czarist Order insignia exists there. Castings of very rare Bulgarian medals are reported, examples include the Alexander accession medal and Ferdinand 25th year reign commemorative medal.

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Graf   

Thank you 922F,

I started the Two Variations Thread, because i got hold of some pieces that can not be considered as fakes since they do not try to decieve the potential byuer .They are just some starnge variations from the Standard ones

The fakes are made to decieve !

Other medal that I have seen as fake is the Medal for Science and Art - very bad copy The details were very blured and unclear.

When ask question do not accept any explanations that this is made during the Regency/Republican period, when the quality of some Decorations dropped This does not apply to these rare medals ..or they are prototype is another explanation for the very bad quality fakes.

Be aware of any Luxury Sets as well. Remember- The Luxury Sets were made for a very special recipients and they were of very high quality made with expensive meterials such as Gold, Silver and Real Diamonds Most of them during Ferdinand period.

Ferdinand will never allow a bad quality Luxury Set to be made. Comiing from one of the richest families in Europe, he was fanatic about quality. Do not be fooled.

Here is an example of modified/butchered good old order to match a Star in a Set

The Star looks OK The Cross is not

- An Old type good cross was butchered by removing the swords on the middle

-The Crown and the swords were added to be "converted" to Military Devision in peace time

-The Cross is made of Silver.the marks on the loop have been erased, however the Crown and the swords are gilded copper or red base metal.

- There is a fake patina on the crown (greenish material --looks like a green paint ...very old trick)

- One of the features of this custom made Set -no sash or ribbon All other custom made Sets have the same problem -no sush or ribbon

-New box - again custom made

Edited by Graf

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To add to what Graf said - I've noticed fakes of high Bulgarian awards started appearing on the market around 2007.

Most of them were offered by a dealer from Bulgaria named Victor. Over the last few years he's been operating on eBay under several names, currently he sells under account "kaissa64".

His tactic is to operate under one name for some time, then close the store and open under different name. Apparently because of the buyers discovering that he sells fakes and probably of complaints they file with eBay.

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To add to what Graf said - I've noticed fakes of high Bulgarian awards started appearing on the market around 2007.

Most of them were offered by a dealer from Bulgaria named Victor. Over the last few years he's been operating on eBay under several names, currently he sells under account "kaissa64".

His tactic is to operate under one name for some time, then close the store and open under different name. Apparently because of the buyers discovering that he sells fakes and probably of complaints they file with eBay.

It shows how markets have changed 20 years ago the fakes would have cost more to produce than the originals were worth.

Paul

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rakkasan   

Hi Everyone,

This doesn't pertain to orders but some proficiency badges I just bought on ebay

Use a common sense and your knowledge and do not jump to any deal because is too good

AMEN......That and beer and ebay don't always mix......I had my guard down and made an offer a bit too hastily. I am posting these photos because after closer scrutiny these look really fake.....especially the reverse.....no mirror detail whatsoever..........

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rakkasan   

I just realized the above post doesn't have much to do with the thread topic.....maybe one of the moderators could move it somewhere more appropriate,

thanks

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Graf   

Hi Rakkasan,

It is Ok. If you noticed some listings, cover medals as well

Any Fake has a place here.

We as collectors have to keep our gurd very high, otherwise we will spend our hard made money for something that has much less value or any value at all.

Graf

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Graf   

Hi,

I can not see anything wrong with the Order

It is very nice 3rd Class -Commander - King Boris Model 1918-1942/3

If you want to be sure it is better to do the "needle test" > Be gentle. and do not try to run the needle along the surface to avoid danage ( sometimes the enamel is protected by a very thin fine layer of coating)

With a fine neddle try to penetrate the green, white and the red enamesl The fake modern enamel is soft and the needle will sink very easy.

I am sure the enamel is OK.

This is picture of my Commander from this Model

If the test is negative i.e, Good then Congrats on the nice buy.

Regards

Graf

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I love the green enamel on the Third Classes, one of the most attractive pieces amongst the Bulgarian series.

Paul

These croses from Boris period were made in Germany and before end of WWI in Austria.

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Graf   

Hi,

Recently I came across those Military Merit Commanders for sale by the same Dealer

Although they are from two different periods I found few featrure that are very similar and rases Questions

1One of The Commander is Boris II Period

2 The other Commander is from the Republican Period

The commo features are

- the both crossess are with the same shape and the saze is less that 54 mm wide Also both are much slimmer that the Standard Boriss Model They are slithly bigger than the Standard Officers of the Boris III Model, however slimmer and thinner compared with an Officer Class

- the patern of red enamel is identical even in the central medalions with specific dark areas along the edges

Also the ozidesed parts of the metal on Boris III Model look very funny .In my opinion it is artificial ageing and deos not match the very new Enamel I might be wrong and too harsh, however we have to be aware

I would like to have your opinion

Originals or Fakes? Is any posibility they have been made in Bulgaria? When?

Graf

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Graf   

Hi,

Recently I came across those Military Merit Commanders for sale by the same Dealer

Although they are from two different periods I found few featrure that are very similar and rases Questions

1One of The Commander is Boris II Period

2 The other Commander is from the Republican Period

The commo features are

- the both crossess are with the same shape and the saze is less that 54 mm wide Also both are much slimmer that the Standard Boriss Model They are slithly bigger than the Standard Officers of the Boris III Model, however slimmer and thinner compared with an Officer Class

- the patern of red enamel is identical even in the central medalions with specific dark areas along the edges

Also the ozidesed parts of the metal on Boris III Model look very funny .In my opinion it is artificial ageing and deos not match the very new Enamel I might be wrong and too harsh, however we have to be aware

I would like to have your opinion

Originals or Fakes? Is any posibility they have been made in Bulgaria? When?

Graf

Edited by Graf

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922F   

Have seen Boris commanders for nearly 45 years & republic for 30--never viewed others with the peculiar dark toning along cross edges, apparently under enamel. Some motto characters a bit odd as well. That said, the Champleve work and the Ferdinand monogram look OK. A blurt on the Boris connector to the suspension--agree with your comments on oxidation of Boris metal. Swords metal work somewhat thin but if whole piece is anemic..... These do NOT appear the same as the pieces awarded to Soviet/Red Army personnel in 1946.

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Graf   

Hi 922F,

Thank you for the comments It looks like a new wave of Fakes are on the market with improved enamel (hard instead of soft type).

However, the similarities and the odd features and those funny oxidation makes them to fail

I had the chance to hold the Republican Model and to take pictures with two Boris Commanders and two Officers

Here are more pictures to compare

Graf

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922F   

Graf--Thank you for these images and continuing information. Are these showing up at club or via dealers and at what price?

The commander war wreath certainly looks off, Seems the ribbon upper bow opening is drilled round instead of conforming to the ribbon and the oak/laurel leaves seem poorly defined. Note badly prepared, off center, poorly configured crosses atop suspension crowns. The republic commander wreath suspension, on the other hand, looks normal.

Faker error in putting so many examples onto market at same time!!

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Graf   

Hi 922F,

The Two Boris III Crosses are OK I did buy them separetly from different Dealers. Perhaps i have to take pictures with closer view

The Commander with War Decoration is fine. I did buy it from Detlev Niemann, when he was still in businnes,. with Certificate

The Problem ones are the Republican and The Boris III Commanders on my first listing.

The similarities are too big for them to be classified from differen periods.Do not worry the Dealer was Smart he did not error ...he listed them one by one on EBay.com

The Boris III Model is stil listed for $988 or "Make an Offer" Deal

Graf

Edited by Graf

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Graf   

Hi,

i just dicovered something interesting

Look those two pictures of the reverse of the crosses

On both crossess the handle of the right sword has identical defect ,that means they were made at the same shop at the same time.This will be impossible if the crosses represent different periods

Other starnge features -similar enamel patern and the same shape of the crosses also sugest that they are identical

In my opinions some of the parts are orininal, however the main bodies and the enamel are recently made

That is worry because the fakers managed to fake the hardness of the enamel

The good news is they still can not match the one of the Old Original Crosses, however they are closing the gap.

In my opinion. both are fakes

What do you think ?

Graf

Edited by Graf

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