JapanX Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 1996 medal. 'RH' on reverse bar. Thanks Rich! Not sure if these marks should be called 'mint marks.' My suspicion is they are inspection stamps. This is certainly one of the possibilities ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dieter3 Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Not "mint marks" like "M" necessarily, but I would think placed there by the mint! I still think they have something to do with chronology. Very likely inspection stamps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 16, 2012 Author Share Posted November 16, 2012 (edited) I still think they have something to do with chronology. If these are chronologocal marks, than how (by what principle) do you think they organized?! You see we have both types of marks, i.e. two-letter marks and letter-number marks. Usually, when the mark is a time mark, only letter-number codes are used Here comes an example from Finland phaleristic (see the last post) http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/53923-order-of-the-white-rose/ Edited November 16, 2012 by JapanX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gensui Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 My suspicion is they are inspection stamps. On a visible area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 16, 2012 Author Share Posted November 16, 2012 On a visible area? Well, I don't think that this area is really that visible... Reverse of the bar... I bet 1 cavalier out of 1000 ever notice these marks BTW, Imperial Russia mint (and private workshops) sometimes stamped marks even on obverses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gensui Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Some (stupid?) thoughts: I would agree, if it would be a mint mark (implies for example "Made in XXX"). But I would assume, that any possible inspection stamps would have done on a box or carton, where all the medals were packed after the producton and inspection. If personal inspection were done - what I strongly believe - why not using kind of inkan / name stamp with kanji? Why latin alphabet? BTW, I guess these marks were hand-made / engraved? Or machined? If machined, same medals (from one mint?) with same marks should be (nearly) on the same position, same strenght, deepness of engravment, etc. But how about different medals with same marks (from different mint)? BR, Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 16, 2012 Author Share Posted November 16, 2012 But I would assume, that any possible inspection stamps would have done on a box or carton, where all the medals were packed after the producton and inspection. You see, mint produces only the medals and orders Boxes (most likely) and ribbons/rosettes (these are for sure) are produced by private subcontractors. We don't know when and where all these ingredients (medal, ribbon, rosette and box + white cardboard box) reassembled together. By mint? Or maybe (more realistically) in decoration bureau? If personal inspection were done - what I strongly believe - why not using kind of inkan / name stamp with kanji? Why latin alphabet? Why Osaka mint used the latin letter M and not some kanji? BTW, I guess these marks were hand-made / engraved? Or machined? It's punching, not engraving. Most likely handmade punching. Best, Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dieter3 Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 If these are chronologocal marks, than how (by what principle) do you think they organized?! You see we have both types of marks, i.e. two-letter marks and letter-number marks. Usually, when the mark is a time mark, only letter-number codes are used Here comes an example from Finland phaleristic (see the last post) http://gmic.co.uk/in...the-white-rose/ Well, I'm still trying to figure this out. But we do see the letter/number combos used for sure after 2003. I don't know that we can necessarily align marks strictly to the gregorian calendar or if we must take into account the Japanese calendar, in which each epoch shares a last and first year (EX: last year of Showa, 1st year of Heisei = 1989 - does this matter in a chronological scheme? These might also represent simple sequences. EX: A0 might represent the first 1,000 medals of a certain type. A1 - the next thousand, etc. Maybe reach 10,000 and change to B0. I'm thinking along the lines of weapons. Although they had serial#s, the numbers would eventually recycle but carry a new character to represent a series. Perhaps a similar scheme? No doubt, they MUST represent something of significance beyond mere inspections marks - why would they change otherwise? Why not just go back to the classic "M"? On a visible area? Not unprecedented. The 1914 War medal is a good example - you can find these unmarked, or with both the kanji "DAI" or katakana "HI" on the backside of the bar, on either left or right side. Also very common to see Sacred Treasures with a number of different marks on the reverse, very prominently displayed. Other orders have them too, but Sacred Treasure seems to have the greatest variety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 16, 2012 Author Share Posted November 16, 2012 Not unprecedented. For japanese orders and medals "typical" will be even better word ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gensui Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 You see, mint produces only the medals and orders Nick, maybe a misunderstanding. I didn't meant the award boxes, which comes together with any medal/order, but a carton (or cardboard box), where all medals were kept before going to the next (production) step... BR, Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fukuoka Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 I have just written to the Mint in both English and Japanese concerning this matter. If we are lucky, a definitive answer will arrive someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 I have just written to the Mint in both English and Japanese concerning this matter. If we are lucky, a definitive answer will arrive someday. I keep my fingers crossed Rich! :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 ... but a carton (or cardboard box), where all medals were kept before going to the next (production) step... Why do you think that they kept them in cardbord boxes? Tell me more :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 Luckily we have HQ pictures for close examination of this piece from posts # 13-15 + document!!! Cavalier name is Sakurai Osamu. The medal and doc was issued on November 3, 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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JapanX Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 Document Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 Details ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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