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This was part of one of the most interesting groups I have ever seen.... Unfortunately I did not get it, but the seller felt guilty and I got the mans Beer mug and the 2nd EK1 from the group.

it is flat, for all intents and purposes an issue piece, but with a "800" stamp under the hook and a Y under the needle.

So far i have only seen Y on EK2s.... has anyone else got one like this?

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I have one only I've never been sure if it's stamped Y or V, it's stamped with the letter and 800 in the same places as the one above. The core is different though especially the crown.

Tony

P.S.: what about LV S E and LW crosses, do you have any? They're my favourite.

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it is flat, for all intents and purposes an issue piece, but with a "800" stamp under the hook and a Y under the needle.

I fear you got me wrong. All awarded crosses are flat ones, but not all that are flat are awarded ones.

With the exception of "CD 800" which I believe to be awarded crosses, I assume most crosses with silver purity marks are privately purchased ones. Furthermore, the "Y" is unlikely to stand for a maker's name. I assume it's rather a controll mark, like they're found on the pins backsides of many crosses e.g. by Sy & Wagner and other main suppliers.

At least, this were my thoughts from yesterday, when I had such a "Y" and "800" marked 1st class cross in hands on a local show... ;)

Edited by saschaw

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But we have EK2s with "Y"... so why not EK1?

The immediate question i would have is... what purpose would a control mark serve in a production process for crosses? all the other firms seems to have made them without needing a special control mark? As it is not a firm that seems to have made large amounts, we could be talking 3-4 people sitting in a room assembling them? If it is a control mark, surely a mark made for the Ordenskommision ? Same as a FR or WS ? As I said above, they used it on EK2s..

Do we know for sure that ONLY Carl D. stamped 800 on award pieces? Why should he have that sole honour? Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that someone else would?

Best

Chris

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I'm not aware on any facts regarding these control marks. We find them, as said, on several makers' pins, and also in the eyelet e.g. of "R" crosses. I don't think they were meant for the GOK, but rather something workshop internal - which explaines only some makers have them. Imagine there were five guys assembling the EK parts at Wagner, and one being a total bumbler...

Do we know for sure that ONLY Carl D. stamped 800 on award pieces?

No, we don't. That's why I said "I believe".

But we have EK2s with "Y"... so why not EK1?

You have an EK1, and I had one in hands yesterday. Finding the mark on 2nd classes, however, is indeed a bit odd but doesn't change much of my thoughts.

Edited by saschaw

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Indeed...

maybe "Y" is a name we have never heard of? Simply a workshop buying parts, assembling them, and sending them in ....

The firm could be Williams and son, 2-3 workers, never existed after 1921, simply given a "y" as a control mark because W in all its forms was taken...., on no collectors radar like "Godet" or "deschler"....

It makes me question.... can we assume we know who all the makers are? What if "y" got parts, assembeled crosses, and noones ever heard of them as it was a three man show?

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The firm could be Williams and son, 2-3 workers, never existed after 1921, simply given a "y" as a control mark because W in all its forms was taken....

While I cannot prove the assumption is wrong, it totally doesn't fit into my thoughts... the letters are first letters of names and sometimes possibly of cities.

It makes me question.... can we assume we know who all the makers are?

I hope noone does!

:blush:

"What we know is a drop, what we don't know is an ocean", as Sir Isaac Newton put it.

Edited by saschaw

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I hope noone does!

:blush:

I dont think anyone does either, but what I mean is... there could have been tiny jeweller companies assembling pieces, companies that no googling or older books will ever bring to light....

The "Y" on the EK2 must mean something, but so far noone has ever advanced a theory of a medal maker starting with "Y".... unless, back to my pet theory, that established firms like Godet got to cherry pic their codes... and what came later were assigned a control letter...

Like Airport codes... FRA for Frankfurt LHR for London Heathrow....

and the canadians get YYZ for Toronto Pearson and YOW for Ottawa....

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