paja Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 (edited) Today for the first time I noticed a monument located in the backyard of Medical Center "Bežanijska kosa". I tried to dig up more about it but haven't had much luck. Apart from one more photo and information that it was built by Serbian authorities after the war nothing else. Inscription is in Serbian and means "Fallen Warriors" (Poginuli ratnici), bellow the list "Unknown" (Nepoznatih). Apart from some cracks its overall state is not so bad and someone relatively recently painted the names which are still readable. Does anyone "from the other side" know something more about it? Edited May 20, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 19, 2016 Author Share Posted May 19, 2016 I apologize if I miswrote some names, I'm not very familiar with Hungarian, if so please correct me. HERMANN BOTH IVAN UNGERBILLER MIHALY BOGDAS IMRE MENES SIMON GABOR JANOS SZAPSZKY MICHAEL VALKOVSZKY JOSEF OLAH LAJOS ILYES PETER SCHNEIDER JANOI ANTAI KIS BALAZS GOLIAN ISTVAN SZEPES LAJOS OLAH JANOS BALOG ENDRES KOKOTI JOZSEF KEREKGYARTO ISTVAN B NAGY LUDWIG HETESHEIMER FRANZ KNECHTSBERGER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 20, 2016 Author Share Posted May 20, 2016 (edited) Just two more photos before I go to sleep. Name of the author is written in the lower right corner, WEIGNER. Search for that name led me nowhere. I don't know if these soldiers were buried or perhaps died at that place close to Zemun which back then was part of Austria-Hungary. Nowadays that area is covered in woods but I don't know was that the case 100 years ago. There is central Hungarian military cemetery located at "Novo groblje" (New Cemetery). Some time ago I read an article that during '30s remains of Hungarian soldiers that were scattered across Belgrade were carried over there. I'll try to find it tomorrow and reveal more information. Edited May 20, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trooper_D Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 Fascinating, Paja. I know that we are all equal in death but, for our purposes, it is a shame that no ranks are stated for these soldiers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markgraf Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Franz Knechtsberger artilleryman born 1890 in Pozsony Festungsartillerie-Regiment No 6. died 1914.12.14. Buried in Zemun Franzenstaler Friedhof (Verlustliste No. 109) http://anno.onb.ac.at/cgi-content/anno?aid=vll&datum=19150121&seite=16&zoom=33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 (edited) Markgraf, thank you! Even though I still have questions without answer your reply really helped me find a missing piece of the puzzle. My first guess was that soldiers were buried on Gardoš cemetery (XVIII century) which has orthodox, catholic and jewish part. I did a little research trying to locate Franzstal cemetery, it turns out there was a whole part of Zemun called that way. Germans started arriving in the early XIX century and their colony was called Franzenstal/Franzstal/Franztal. Their church, Hl. Wendel Kirche, was built in 1893 with the cemetery not very far from there, to be more precise on the exact same place where I noticed that monument! According to several online sources after the Second World War ended new communist authorities demolished the church in order to expand the school which was next to it. Where once stood cemetery they built a hospital! I'm still trying to discover what have they done with the earthly remains, I can only presume they were put in some kind of collective tomb. Some of the tombstones were used to make stairway in the part of Zemun called Kalvarija. I think most of them were eventually replaced but you can still see inscriptions on some of them. If everything I wrote is true and I have no reason to think otherwise, I wonder why would they remove everything except for that monument, especially because it's a soldiers' monument. Edited May 23, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 1896 vs 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markgraf Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 paja: Great research! I think found in the Verlustliste Jozsef Kerékgyártó and Balázs Golián too. Both of them served in the 3. Honved Infantry Regiment, and they were wounded in action in November 1914. According the sources in Zemun were an auxiliary military hospital (on names: Vereinsspital/Vereins Ersatz Spital/Vereinsfilialspital). I think these soldiers died there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 (edited) This subject is very interesting to me because all of these places are not more than 5-10 minutes away from my home. I continued online search and stumbled upon website of the Franztaler association. They erected a monument in 2011 at "Novo bežanijsko groblje" (New Bežanija cemetery) and some of the remaining tombstones were put there. The article is in German, google translate left some things unclear so could someone who speaks the language tell us is the crypt also there? I understood that some of the remains were transferred in 1950/51 to Bežanija, but they don't say where exactly, I presume Old Bežanija cemetery. http://www.franztal.at/wir/gedenkst%C3%A4tte-neu-belgrad/ I'll try to visit some of these cemeteries in the following days, as soon as I do that I'll post more information and photos. IN MEMORIAM To Franztal-Zemun inhabitants who passed away around the world. To German inhabitants of Franztal-Zemun who lost their homeland. Edited May 23, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 26, 2016 Author Share Posted May 26, 2016 (edited) I continued the search and visited Staro bežanijsko groblje (Old Bežanija cemetery). After going through the main entrance I turned left and some 50 m further noticed a monument with inscription in German "DEN HELDEN DES WELTKRIEGES 1914-1918" (Heroes of World War 1914-18) with Iron Cross above it. It's located right between tombstones and its position is very unusual. Edited May 26, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 26, 2016 Author Share Posted May 26, 2016 Iron Cross makes me think this could be the final resting place of German soldiers. Is it unusual to see that symbol on Austro-Hungarian monuments? I did my best to discover more about these places but information are very hard to find. I'm wondering could this be that place on Bežanija where they moved some of the remains and possibly tombstones in 1951... Notice the damage, bullet holes perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markgraf Posted May 27, 2016 Share Posted May 27, 2016 I think the cross was a central monument of a WWI parcel - the surrounding individual graves were liquidated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 29, 2016 Author Share Posted May 29, 2016 That's small Bežanija village cemetery, it's much older than the new one, I don't know how much exactly but some of the tombstones I saw are from XIX century. During the war artillery was located at Bežanija shelling Serbian troops across the river in Belgrade. I think there are two possibilities here, either there was military graveyard from the beginning on that small village cemetery, either that's the place where it was moved from Franztal graveyard. Considering the size of the cemetery I doubt there could have been larger military cemetery there, especially not with individual tombstones. Yesterday I visited German memorial cemetery on New graveyard, I'll post some photos later. There are over 130 tombstones, many of them look the same, they are small and modest, shaped as cross. Seems to me they could be soldiers' tombstones from military cemetery. Unfortunately most of the names are completely unreadable. I'll post photos of those that can be read, maybe something can be dug up in the archives about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 29, 2016 Author Share Posted May 29, 2016 (edited) German memorial cemetery at New Bežanija cemetery. Edited May 29, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 29, 2016 Author Share Posted May 29, 2016 Jesus monument, KARL NIESZNER 1932. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 29, 2016 Author Share Posted May 29, 2016 Monument to Franztal residents and couple of photos of the demolished church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogi Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 Fantastic research and amazing findings so far and many thanks for sharing your photos with us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 30, 2016 Author Share Posted May 30, 2016 (edited) Thnaks, Rogi! Few more photos, I suspect these tombstones were from military cemetery. Edited May 30, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 30, 2016 Author Share Posted May 30, 2016 (edited) ADAM HILI I (?) WALENTIN PINZ WENDELIN PINZ Metal cross Edited May 30, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted May 30, 2016 Author Share Posted May 30, 2016 German commemorative cemetery is located between parcels number 25 and 140. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 (edited) I went to see that stairway in Zemun and you can really tell that some parts of it were made out of tombstones. Most of the stones look the usual but there are two levels almost completely made out of some reddish stone of much greater quality. Edited June 3, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 I noticed one of them has an inscription, I think it goes like this: ...MALD SEMLIN Perhaps place of birth and place of death, Semlin is the German name for Zemun. There's a nice view when you climb up. The tower that can be seen all the way to the left is Hungarian Gardoš or Millennium Tower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 (edited) Location of the stairway, name of the street is "Prilaz" (Прилаз). A minute away from there, at the corner of the "Prilaz" and "Tošin bunar" (Тошин бунар) streets is the Evangelistic Church (circled on the map). Edited June 3, 2016 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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