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jaeger7

Family Group M.G.C. - R.A.S.C. / WWI-WWII-Postwar

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Hello,

the following group turned up in Germany (former BAOR territory).

Both groups are named to the pretty uncommon name "Smith" - but being found in the same estate in Germany makes me think that there is a family connection, possibly father and son ?

Unfortunatly father and son would have never really meet - as George Joseph Smith fell in 1918 only 19 years old. He served in the Great War as Gunner in the Machine Gun Corps in a Motor-bataillon.

I was really impressed that it is easy to find information on him and that there is the possibility to print a kind of commemorative certificate once you have found him in the lists of the Commonwealth War Graves Commision !  He rests on a cemetery at the Somme.

His Group consists of a War Medal and a Victory Medal, both in paper envelopes, with their ribbons, a letter regarding the shipment of the medals to the next-of-kin and a letter of condolence from King George - all in a cardboard box with his name and service number on.

The possible son served in WWII and his medals are arranged to a bar, consisting of

- The 1939-1945 Star
- The Africa Star with bar 1st Army
- The Italy Star
- The Defence Medal
- The 1939-45 War Medal

Of course these Medals are all unnamed - but still serving during the Cold War earned him a

- Long and Good Conduct Medal with clasp Regular Army - and this is named to

T/122935  S SGT  L. C. Smith R.A.S.C

Even not being a collector of British decorations, I guess these two groups are a realy nice pick-up !

Regards

jaeger7-de

 

 

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH.jpg

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH-1.jpg

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH-2.jpg

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH-3.jpg

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH-4.jpg

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH-5.jpg

SMITH_GEORGE_JOSEPH-6.jpg

Smith_Sen-1.jpg

Smith_Sen-2.jpg

Smith_Sen-4.jpg

Smith_Sen-5.jpg

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A very nice find indeed and it would be nice to be able to link the two Recipients as family Members. The 1911 Census is available online and it may be worth your while trying to find George Joseph Smith there and hopefully tracing a link between the two.

Thanks for showing but be careful, you may get bitten by the British Medal collecting bug!:D

Regards Simon.

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The WWI group is only missing its memorial plaque so a very nice, almost complete find. According to Soldier Died he served in the ASC (RASC) too but probably before arriving in France.

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Please forgive me if I ask a foolish question. I’m trying to learn the service requirements for obtaining ww2 medals. How could the son qualify for the home defense medal if he also qualified for the Africa, Italy, and war medal? Not to mention the long service medal. Thanks. 

Mike

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20 hours ago, Mike McLellan said:

Please forgive me if I ask a foolish question. I’m trying to learn the service requirements for obtaining ww2 medals. How could the son qualify for the home defense medal if he also qualified for the Africa, Italy, and war medal? Not to mention the long service medal. Thanks. 

Mike

Here's the entitlement for British forces, it's different for other Commonwealth troops as far as I know:

  • 1080 days (3 years) service in the UK between 3 Sep 1939 and 8 May 1945
  • 1080 days (3 years) service in the Home Guard between 14 May 1940 and 31 Dec 1944 
  • 360 days (1 year) non operational service overseas between 3 Sep 1939 and 2 Sep 1945
  • 180 days non operational service in an overseas area deemed to be closely threatened or subject to air attack between 3 September 1939 and 8 May 1945

In more detail here https://www.gov.uk/guidance/medals-campaigns-descriptions-and-eligibility#world-war-2-medals 

I don't think he'd have been the son of the Gnr. GJ Smith as the NOK are the parents rather than a wife. Perhaps a nephew but that's just me thinking out loud.

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On 20/10/2018 at 09:59, coldstream said:

A very nice find indeed and it would be nice to be able to link the two Recipients as family Members. The 1911 Census is available online and it may be worth your while trying to find George Joseph Smith there and hopefully tracing a link between the two.

Thanks for showing but be careful, you may get bitten by the British Medal collecting bug!:D

Regards Simon.

Hello Simon,

no, I am immune against the British Medal collecting bug - I have been bitten by other bugs too often !
(Imperial German Light Infantry, Imperial German Shooting Awards, Orders and Decorations of the Principality Schaumburg-Lippe, Vintage Photographs....need to say more ?)

I do not think that the 1911 Census will help, as George Joseph has only been 12 years old in 1911 - so no chance of finding a trace to his unborn son (I still like the father/son theory...)

Regards

Torsten

On 21/10/2018 at 10:20, Tony said:

The WWI group is only missing its memorial plaque so a very nice, almost complete find. According to Soldier Died he served in the ASC (RASC) too but probably before arriving in France.

Hello Tony,

one question regarding the plaque - it is much bigger than the box with the papers and decorations. Was it issued later / separate from the medals ?

Did your relatives have to apply for the plaque or was it send to all families which have lost a member during the Great War ?

Regards

Torsten

Edited by jaeger7

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