Tom

Goodmorning, This picture is taken after the attack of the ILR on Fleury on 11 July 1916. The men are indeed from the ILR. The picture is taken in Chaumont. The French soldiers of the 167th regiment were taken prissoner in the area of the Poudriére the Fleury. A stronghold that the ILR took that day. greetings from Holland, Tom

It is the valley where also the Carri?rres d'Haudromont were. This is the first valley when you drive from Bras to the battlefield. In the valley the road goes in a sharp curve. Btw. there are more valleys in Verdun that they used to call Totenschlucht.

I agree. It is always the rule when two grazy persons go bidding...the sky is the limit. What is interesting in my eyes on this kr?tschen are the markings.

I think they did this in case their wasn't enough leather.

Very interesting piece Jens. Incredible two that it is from your regiment!

Yep, you know me to well, haha I had an discussion with an fellowfriend and collector yesterday and we came to the conclusion that: 1. the shoulderboards are absolutely good (feel, smel, touch etc.); 2. they are infanterie (white under it); 3. they are Bavarian (blue stripes); 4. the crown is an Prussian one. The last conclusion is most interesting because of the boards being bavarian. What often happened he told me is that Prussian fabrics made stuff for the Bavarians and way around. That means basecly that they used what they could find and what looked like it. Also interesting is the difference between the Bavarian crown and the Prussian one which can even been seen on the Pickelhaube. The crown of Prussia has under points and the Bavarian one stripe diamant stripe etc. The Prussian crown has an cross directly attached to the point of the crown and the Bavarian one has the cross above the point.

I totaly agree with you on this Bernhard. When one studies the battle of Verdun the Reichsarchiv are most of the time correct or the most in the wright direction. Also nice are the books of the Reichskriegsministerium, especially part 10. This book contains the working method of the German hight command. Also with maps btw.

Haha, when you keep on coming with this high interesting stuff I stay awake all the time.

Chris, Extremely interesting document you have here. The story behind this document must indeed be enormous if you look at the places he have been.

Dave, Thank you for the information. I think indeed this must be an variation of the crown of the Infanterie Leib Regiment. I looked closer at some other crowns and variations on the shoulderboards. The one to come most close is the one of the Prussian Husaren.

Ineresting topic Chris. Does the soldier describe the place at the Verdunfront where they were?

Interesting story on Frederick, thank you.

Small world indeed.

Thank you for the answers. The shoulderboards, later posted, indeed look like the board on page 250 of the book. The band of the crown is indeed with diamends and not points. Also the upper cross on the crown is higher than the crown and not directly attached to it. The same crowns are on; 1. The feldgrauer Waffenrock fur Offiziere M1910 page 150, 279 2. Waffenrock zur feldgrauen Friedensrock M1915 page 160 3. Bayerische einheitsmantel fur Offiziere M1916 page 197 4. Waffenrock M1916 fur offiziere page 282 Are their any known variations in the crowns of the Leibregiment? Are the boards I posted for sure Bavarian and could they be Bavarian but from an other regiment? For what kind uniform are these boards; active or Friedens?

When I am thinking now...if my conclusion must state than the man on the left is Friedrich III who died very quick (something with his longs). Than the child in the lower part of the photo must be Kronprinz Wilhelm the later Armycommander of the German Vth Army.