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paja

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Posts posted by paja

  1. 4 hours ago, BalkanCollector said:

    Sorry for getting back to Partisan Stars but take a look at this huge group of 3rd classes. I don't remember where I've seen this photo but I remember that the guy who posted it said he got all of them from IKOM right after the breakup of Yugoslavia. Maybe it's true or maybe he invented the story so he can sell his fakes. If I remember correctly the guy was from Russia.

    pz3.jpg.2962ebf418c97efd487d87bec98f20b3.jpg

    I've seen that photo floating around internet, Tim B posted it HERE.

    Some of  his comments that followed:
    -"These are actually listed on ebay currently. The guy is trying to sell each one for US $120. or best offer. On another listing, he is selling the entire group. I think $120. is too expensive as you can get these off major dealer sites for less and the soviet made ones (which are better quality) as cheap as $40. if you look around.
    Yes, the PIC is nice and I really would like one of these, but not for $120."

    -"Well supposedly, I see where the seller claims to have sold one for $89. (I don't believe it though) and now lists only the group sale options (5 for $499. or 50 for $3,499.!!!) Guess he wants $100./ea uh?!  Still claims they are real silver content."

    This was back in 2009, 100$ was too expensive even then and nowadays you can get them from 10-15$...

  2. Very interesting, thanks for sharing. I agree with you, looks too shinny, perhaps cleaned - I know, I know, that can't be the answer every time :) I've seen some unnumbered five torches orders with double horizontal needle looking that shinny, perhaps some amount of those later variants were coated with lacquer, I'm just guessing. Same goes for the orders with six torches.
    If Hajduk's decoration is with screw then it's probably cleaned, at least that's my opinion.
    When you look at the document you can see that there's a six torches coat of arms in the upper part but the illustration of the order in the middle is with five torches. That just proves they weren't looking after the details that much. 

  3. Frankly speaking I have no idea where are they coming from and what's the story behind them but they are flooding the market and I don't like them at all.
    Those numbered six torches orders had medallions with five torches and screws in the beginning. After the constitutional change of the coat of arms in 1963 orders with five torches had their central medallions replaced with new ones with six torches. Apart from that screws on the back side were cut off and replaced with needles. That's the reason why we can see orders with IKOM hallmark and vertical needle with ZIN/ZNB inscription.
    Making orders for export doesn't sound like something any government would do, at least a normal one :D

  4. 17 hours ago, Eric Gaumann said:

    The more correct term would be 'rotating tool engraved'.  I think the Mondvor site uses that term for the late-era Soviet awards engraved in that manner.  Apologies for being pedantic.  It's easier to differentiate between the two styles.

    Thanks for clarification, no need to apologize.
    According to Rudež, after the war IKOM made unnumbered Partisan Stars with screw and his book remains the main source of information about Yugoslav decorations to this day.
    Stojan Rudež was the chief of the Chancellery of Orders for some time during the eighties. Based on his signatures on the awarding certificates I'm guessing from 1983 until 1984. 

  5. Here's one more 2nd class Partisan Star and then I'll move to the Brotherhood & Unity order.
    Photos are from ebay, it got sold last month for 193$.
    Seller's description: "Made from silver. IKOM ZAGREB mint, never seen."
    LINK
    This one is pretty much the same as the previous one, high number (8K), two hallmarks (IKOM and rooster), front side flaws...
    6.thumb.JPG.c0cbf401ae602937f4e13175e2f8fc3c.JPG
    1.jpg.ed6078b9fd88a68430dbbecef45ed420.jpg
    3.jpg.2c80c0d06ea69fdb3bd77fc863d0b7f7.jpg
    4.jpg.d0afe9cf11a36adb163039f74cc3f8b4.jpg
    5.thumb.jpg.aa7962d7d5b5537d5dad471dfdf8d2ab.jpg

  6. Even though most authors consider the inscription "FOR BRAVERY 1876" was on the back side I don't think that's entirely true.
    The first regulation from 1876 states so but the following one from 1878 introduces a different solution, "FOR BRAVERY" is on the front side of the medal. 
    According to regulations "FOR BRAVERY" side was the back side only for around 19 months.

  7. 1 hour ago, BalkanCollector said:

    I don't like these at all. The 2nd class' screw pin looks like it isn't in center at all. The 1st class' wreath is way too thin.

    Maybe those are actually mint flaws which were common for this order...

    I think you're right about the 2nd class' screw not being centered. I've only seen two or three IKOM made 1st classes and they also looked like that.

    Perhaps, but then again it's unusual to see so many flawed decorations coming out of IKOM, especially those uneven edges on the back side.

    1 hour ago, BalkanCollector said:

    Talking about shinny, I have this documented group of Order of Labour with Golden Wreath and Order of Merits for the People with Silver Rays awarded to the single person which I think it's 100% authentic. Is it just me or does it have that shinny too good to be true look although I think it's legit?

    Everything looks authentic to me as well. First of all these are not made out of silver, but even some non precious metals and alloys catch patina and I believe you can see some of it on the back side of the Labor Order and the front side of the Merits for the People. I think someone cleaned them up a bit at some point, especially the Labor Order. I had one 3rd class like that, front side shinny, back side patinated, so what happened? I believe someone cleaned it up and then back side being in contact with that synthetic material inside the box patinated faster.
    If you take a look at the double needle Labor Order (2nd and 3rd class) which was the last type (not that remade variant), you can see that most of them shine, but I don't think there's anything wrong with them. Silver was not used for their production, I'm pretty sure they aren't silvered and I always had a feeling they applied a thin layer of some kind of lacquer over them.

  8. Partisan Star 2nd Class

    Up until the last year IKOM made 2nd classes were extremely rare and then all of the sudden they started flooding the market. As the time goes by their number is increasing, I noticed five stars this month alone.
    All of them are hallmarked (IKOM and rooster) and numbered (so far 78XX-81XX). They also look new and shinny and have those ugly wider screw nuts.
    Here are couple of photos of the first one I noticed, it got sold over Serbian internet auction site for nearly 500 euros and then ended up on ebay. Nowadays you can easily get them for around 80 euros.
    59f8e5f963357_78821.thumb.jpg.94f6edadfece2e4aebed32efd4d1289e.jpg
    59f8e600d9541_78822.thumb.jpg.862963c288c8756b8293da73edb1440c.jpg

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