Pete A Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 (edited) Jani:Nice bars! And it's nice to have someone here who actually knows something about Finnish awards, so welcome! Rick:I know that at least one naval aviation officer, Leutnant zur See Droege took part of the ?land-expedition. No idea though, if he got a CoL or not. The site of "Institut Deutsche Adelsforschung" shows three navy Droeges during 1914/18:Droege, Gerhard, Seekadett Droege, Heinrich, Leutnant zur See Droege, Rudolf, Leutnant zur See Also, in addition to those R?gen-guys, there likely was some naval aviators in the Finnish Air Force. I have some names back home that aren't yet listed in the "other" Finnish thread. I'll see if any of them is a navy guy.Pete Edited March 3, 2006 by Pete A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 And here is the badge of the Rugen guys ...This is unfortunately not mine and I am desperately seeking one in to my collection //Jani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 And my Saxon bar with Finnish medal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 and another...(Still want moreeeee....)Jani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 reverse with nice Godet tag. //Jani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 And I thought you could use my Cross of Liberty 2nd X 1918 for a "Germans with Finnish awards" page for your upcoming book! Pete: that was Heinrich Droege, born 21 July 1892. Aviation training December 1916 and served (no specific dates) with Seeflieger Station Libau, SFS Windau, the Seeflieger Versuchs-Kommission in Warnem?nde (as Adjutant). Char. Oberlt zS aD, in 1939 Dr.jur. and in law partnership as a Rechtsanwalt in Hamburg. The February 1918 Marien Rangliste shows him with EK 1 and 2 and Hamburg Hanseatic Cross. Given his Baltic service, he is a very likely candidate for a Mecklenburg indeed. Rudolf (b. 14.3.96) served only on torpedo boats, and Gerhard (b. 8.2.99) never left training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 And I thought you could use my Cross of Liberty 2nd X 1918 for a "Germans with Finnish awards" page for your upcoming book! Yes I could... since I dont have any groups with 2nd class Cross of Liberty ...I have been so close... so many times...Jani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webr55 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 I have a question concerning the Cross of Liberty 2nd class X. Earlier in this thread I assumed that this was given only to Hptm/KapLts and up. Now I find that the bio of later Gen d. Pztr Hans-Karl Freiherr von Esebeck states that he was awarded the Cross of Liberty 2nd class X on 7.05.1918 while still being an Oberleutnant in the 3rd Guards-Cavalry-Brigade. Could Oberlts also receive the 2nd class? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 I have a question concerning the Cross of Liberty 2nd class X. Earlier in this thread I assumed that this was given only to Hptm/KapLts and up. Now I find that the bio of later Gen d. Pztr Hans-Karl Freiherr von Esebeck states that he was awarded the Cross of Liberty 2nd class X on 7.05.1918 while still being an Oberleutnant in the 3rd Guards-Cavalry-Brigade. Could Oberlts also receive the 2nd class?OberStleutnant could have received 2nd class. With foreigners the criteria has neither been that strict.Jani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webr55 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 (edited) OberStleutnant could have received 2nd class. With foreigners the criteria has neither been that strict.JaniDo you mean Oberstleutnant (Lt. Col.) or Oberleutnant (1st Lt.)?ThanksChris Edited March 4, 2006 by webr55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 Lieutenant Colonel.In 1918, at least, the Finns tended to give Germans a "courtesy" bump up of a class above their actual rank, but I seriously doubt whether any First Lieutenant ever got a 2nd Class. I suspect that, if written as such, is an error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Danner Posted March 5, 2006 Share Posted March 5, 2006 That is what his bio says, though. Oberleutnant as of 6 June 1916, then Rittmeister on 1 March 1923.From 24 February 1918: Adjutant, 3.Garde-Kavallerie-Brigade. 8 September 1918-27 September 1918: Detached to the Military Commission in St. Petersburg. His Cross of Liberty II. Class with Swords is as of 7 May 1918. My best guess is that while dated as of then, he didn't actually get it until later, and the Finns may have given him a "bump up" based not on his grade as of then, but as of the date actually conferred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted March 5, 2006 Share Posted March 5, 2006 Here is my contribution... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jani Tiainen Posted March 5, 2006 Share Posted March 5, 2006 Do you mean Oberstleutnant (Lt. Col.) or Oberleutnant (1st Lt.)?ThanksChrisI meant Oberstleutnant, since I thought it might have been misreading or something Adjuntant might be the key for bumbed up award (?)Jani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted March 5, 2006 Share Posted March 5, 2006 I think if a photo shows up of him wearing his medal bar, it will then be seen to have been copied/listed as a 2nd Class by mistake for a 3rd Class. I have the "Fragebogen" of a General Staff Hauptmann and HE mistakenly listed his own CoL as "1st Class." They weren't great on Exotic Foreign Stuff!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webr55 Posted March 5, 2006 Share Posted March 5, 2006 (edited) Rick Research said: I think if a photo shows up of him wearing his medal bar, it will then be seen to have been copied/listed as a 2nd Class by mistake for a 3rd Class. I think so too. Here is a photo, but you can't see anything. Edited November 14, 2017 by webr55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete A Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 That has to be a 3rd class. And even that was "bumbed up", given his rank and duty. Since he probably didn't receive anything more than a piece of MoL2 ribbon on 7th of may, that might have led in to a mix-up.Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Hello,my first post at this forum and in this very interesting thread.I have a group from a Stephan Euler that served in Finland 1918. He was a doctor.Regards, Stefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Well. Let the "It's A Small World After All" song commence.I bought Assistenarzt dR Stephan Euler's VERY interesting (but very plain and very ugly) lonely, nothing-else Iron Cross 2nd Class document on 25 July 1991 from our very own Jeff Floyd. Alas, I sold it on 23 May 1995 and do not have a scan, but since I know where it went, may be able to get that done.Euler was born 4 January 1890 in Epertshausen, HESSE, per that document, issued to him 22 December 1916 by BAVARIAN Sanit?tskompagnie 10 (10th Bavarian Infantry Division) and, although just handwritten on notepaper and signed off by the COMPANY commander, an Oberleutnant dL aD, it gave full CITATION details:"for brave conduct and exhausting medical activity at the main casualty Clearing Station, Thilloy/Bapaume during the English offensive 2-22.7.16 and for battles in the Carpathian mountains in Sept. & Oct. 1916."("only" an EK2!!!!!!!!!!!)But wait! It gets better!Lo and behold, I have Dr. Stephan Euler in the 1941 Augsburg Region phone book as Dr.med. in private practice at Aeschach, Lindau (Phone number 21-55 if you want to try calling! ) and THAT I can scan.I think a new thread just on Dr. Euler is in order. Can you make nice big CLEAR scans of his documents? With some luck, I will be able to get his EK2 document scanned this Sunday-- it is promised for a 1914 1918 Iron Cross award documents project already, just haven't managed to get it and me back together yet."...it's a small, small world..." Group Splitting Idiots Of The World: We of the Internet Collecting Community DEFY you! What YOU have put asunder, WE can (at least through scans & CONTACT) put back TOGETHER! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe campbell Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 stefan-very good to see you here!this is turning out to be quite fascinating.i look forward to these document scans.joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Hello guys!Thanks for the welcome Joe.WOW!! It IS a small world!Thanks for the info Rick :-)I have tried to find something but I don't have the reference books as you have. When I do have the time I hope to go to the war archives in Finland and do some research of him and also Swedes.Rick - can you perhaps tell the EK doc buyer that I would love to get in touch with him I will start a new Euler thread soon...Sk?l, Stefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webr55 Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 (edited) Here's a new one I just got. Am I right that this should be a dR officer with either a prewar LD2 or a postwar LD1? Can't be an XXV, or he would have got a higher grade of the Cross of Liberty. So this should be a 1918 Oberleutnant dR - or maybe a senior Leutnant dR? Edited November 14, 2017 by webr55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webr55 Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 (edited) The back: Edited November 14, 2017 by webr55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 I think you are right about this being a reserve officer, probably an Oberleutnant.Now-- look at that last ribbon again. It is NOT the 1918 Finnish War of Independence campaign medal-- it is the lapel bow version of the old M1825 Prussian IX years service brooch....being USED as "close enough... nobody will notice..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webr55 Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 (edited) Rick Research said: Now-- look at that last ribbon again. It is NOT the 1918 Finnish War of Independence campaign medal-- it is the lapel bow version of the old M1825 Prussian IX years service brooch.... being USED as "close enough... nobody will notice..." I didn't notice that! But you are right, of course! Like this: Edited November 14, 2017 by webr55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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