Italy - Ribbon Bar Set WW1 & WW2

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Gents,

thought I would share this, my latest win on Ebay:

I am familiar with some but not all the ribbons, the three large pieces, no idea at all, any suggestions please.

While this group set me back a staggering 5 Euro 50 cents, the seller is looking for 20 Euro to post from Germany to Romania

I sent a message suggesting they check out the prices on the Deutschepost.de web-site, I think sent Registered it should not be more than 5-7 euro.

If and when it gets here I will post more detailed pictures.

Kevin in Deva

[Andwwils]

Neat stuff, reminds me of "A Farewell to Arms." I have very little knowledge in regards to Italian ribbons,etc but shouldn't there be a WWI Victory Medal ribbon somewhere?

[Hauptmann]

Hallo Gents,

thought I would share this, my latest win on Ebay:

I am familiar with some but not all the ribbons, the three large pieces, no idea at all, any suggestions please.

While this group set me back a staggering 5 Euro 50 cents, the seller is looking for 20 Euro to post from Germany to Romania

I sent a message suggesting they check out the prices on the Deutschepost.de web-site, I think sent Registered it should not be more than 5-7 euro.

If and when it gets here I will post more detailed pictures.

Kevin in Deva

Hi Kevin,

Right off the bat those three large pieces... I believe they're sleeve rank insignia for a Sub-Lieutenant in the Italian Royal Navy during WWII. Equivalent of a 2nd Lt. in their Army.

I'll see what I can come up with on the ribbons.

Dan

[Hauptmann]

Hi Kevin,

Okay... here we go:

Three ribbon bar on the lower left of the pic which is upside down:

Cross of War

Not sure????

Medal for the Albanian Campaign

I went on the assumption that these have lightened a bit with age, being in the sun, etc.

The big blue and white section of ribbon is for the Cross of War (Croce di Guerra).

The one just above that is for the medal for the War of Independence. I can only assume the star means there was one or more additional awards of the medal.

Three ribbon bar below the large Cross of War ribbon:

Cross of War

Spanish Campaign 3rd type

Volunteer in Spain 1st type

Then up to the top right hand three ribbon bar:

Cross of War and Military Valor (the latter is signified by the sword device on the ribbon)

Cross of War

War medal (1915-1918) (Hard to see but if it's green/white/red repeated (total 6 times) then that should be it, with multiple awards I'd assume due to the stars.)

Bar on cloth backing:

First Row:

Not sure????

Italo Turkish War (1911) medal

Not sure????

Second Row:

Medal of Italian Unity

Campaign in Spain 3rd Type

Volunteer in Spain 2nd Type

Third Row:

Italian Republic - Long Service (Officer or NCO) in the Public Security Police (Not sure on this one... closest I can come to an Italian ribbon with 9 red stripes on a white background.

The embroidered gold star is, I believe, simply a collar device worn by Italian Army Officers.

I hope I at least got the majority of this right.

Hope it helps.

Dan

[Guest Rick Research]

The equally striped faded green/white with crown device/faded green is Military Long Service Cross. Not sure what the device denotes.

[Hauptmann]

The equally striped faded green/white with crown device/faded green is Military Long Service Cross. Not sure what the device denotes.

Hi Rick,

Still not sure of the award but here is a quote on the crowns from Ribbons Of Orders, Decorations And Medals by Guido Rosignoli:

"Small metal crowns are worn attached to the service ribbon in order to identify the class of an order; three, two and one gold crowns are worn by the three top classes respectively, a silver crown identifies the Officer while the Knight wears the plain ribbon"

I originally thought the ribbons were blue white blue... with the one faded grey white gray. But I can't find any to match any of those or a faded green white green either. But the crown devices match those pictured in his book.

Dan

[Hauptmann]

Possibly this one if it is indeed a green white green ribbon?

Dan

[Jacky]

Nice cross, Hauptman!

Still a version from the age of Victor Emanuel.

But this is indeed very green, while the other is faded blue...

I don't think that the paint in such a relatively short time could go from green to blue-ish....

But it might still be possible, then the crown could denote some extra years or a mention of bravery what ever.

Kind regards,

Jacky

[Hauptmann]

Nice cross, Hauptman!

Still a version from the age of Victor Emanuel.

But this is indeed very green, while the other is faded blue...

I don't think that the paint in such a relatively short time could go from green to blue-ish....

But it might still be possible, then the crown could denote some extra years or a mention of bravery what ever.

Kind regards,

Jacky

Hi Jacky,

Actually... it's a set of pics I pulled off of Ebay. Not actually my cross... wish it was as it's is indeed a nice one. Sorry I didn't clarify on that point.

Anyhow I'm just not sure on those particular ribbons. I've tried all my references on awards and can't find that one. But it definitely looks like those crowns are the same as shown in my Rosignolli reference on Italian Orders. Hopefully someone will come up with it.

Dan

[Hendrik]

Hello Kevin & All,

Nice purchase Kevin !

Some thoughts on the top right ribbon bars :

I think the top strip of three became detached from the multiple rows just below it ...

Thus the ribbons would be :

Military Valour War Cross

War Merit Cross

1915-18 War Medal (stars denoting dated bars for the medal)

Long Service Cross (crown denoting 25 years ???)

Italo-Turkish or Libya Campaign Medal (same ribbon for both of these - stars again denoting dated bars)

Possibly the Long Maritime Navigation Medal (although it should be adorned with an anchor device ...)

Italian Unity Medal

Spanish Campaign Medal

Spanish Campaign Volunteer Medal

and, finally, the 1940-43 Medal (with stars for dated bars) if the ribbon was, at some time, green with red stripes. It looks to me the only possible one in that particular spot on the ribbon set.

Cheers,

Hendrik

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Gentlemen

many thanks for your kind comments with regards this group, the original auction photo was very dark so I highlighted it a little. After querying the postage rates the seller has not responded as yet so I sent word I would pay for delivery to a German address, and then get a buddy to forward it on to me in Romania, the group sold for 5.50 Euro and the seller charges 20 Euro to post to Romania as a way the get some thing extra.

I have at least 4 of the medals mentioned and will take some pictures to show very soon.

Kevin in Deva.

Edited April 5, 2007 by Kev in Deva

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Gents,

I finally got the set of Italian ribbons via my buddy in Germany, thereby saving 15 Euros on the postage charge the seller wanted to post direct to Romania, seems some people dont realise Romania is now in the E.U. and even before it was it did not cost 20 Euro to post letters here, just plain greed. probably trying to claw something back as the auction ended at only 5.50 euro, probably didnt help with them being described as "english".

I have broken the set into sections for pictures,

in the first set the top row is loose from the black backing material, I presume the sword on the blue and white ribbon goes first Hendrick mentioned in his post this could be for the War Merit Cross (a picture would be appriceated of this award), the swords as all the devices are made from silver-wire bullion and not pressed metal.

Close up of the Sword device.

Kevin in Deva.

[Kev in Deva]

The third ribbon top row is for the 1915 - 1918 Victory Medal (not to be confused with the Italian Inter-Allied Victory Medal).

Though faded there was green stripes there once upon a time.

The Fourth ribbon was for Military Service, the crown to is made from silver bullion, here too the green has faded to the left and right of the white. (I wonder does the crown indicate Officer service?).

The Fifth ribbon for the Italian-Turkish War of 19111 -1912. (or Libian Service.)

The Sixth ribbon denotes: "Possibly the Long Maritime Navigation Medal (although it should be adorned with an anchor device" ...)

The Seventh ribbon denotes: The Unity of Italy Medal.

The Eighth Ribbon denotes: The Spanish Campaign Medal.

The Ninth Ribbon denotes: The Spanish Campaign Volunteer Medal.

Kevin in Deva

[Kev in Deva]

The final ribbon denotes the the 1940-43 Medal (with stars for dated bars), to the rear of the ribbon can be seen thin green stripes.

Kevin in Deva

[Kev in Deva]

The second bar is for 3 medals: The Cross of War, The Spanish Campaign Medal, Volunteer in Spain (1st type).

and the ribbons are fixed to a plastic type backing, that probably is fixed to loops in the uniform jacket.

Kevin in Deva

[Kev in Deva]

The next 3 ribbon bar is for: Cross of War, Italian Military Service Cross with pressed metal crown, Albanian Campaign.

The ribbons are mounted (paste?) to a thin metal strip.

Kevin in Deva

[Hendrik]

a picture would be appriceated of this award

Hello Kevin,

Have a look at this one : http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?s=&showtopic=3770&view=findpost&p=37086

The one you have the ribbon of is the second award in the top row of that group. I notice now I made a mistake in calling it the War Merit Cross :

The War Merit Cross is the same cross but without the sword device ! With the device, the name changes to The War Cross (or the War Cross for Military Valour) and as such is a bravery award rather than a decoration for meritorious war service.

You'll also notice another War Merit Cross in that WWI group, 3rd one in the top row. It has a small crown on its ribbon denoting a subsequent award of same ...

All rather confusing, I know, but it gets worse when you add the WWII variations and a new ribbon to the above

Cheers,

Hendrik

[Kev in Deva]

To all the Gentlemen, who have contributed to this thread so far many thanks for your opinions

sleeve rank insignia for a Sub-Lieutenant in the Italian Royal Navy during WWII. Equivalent of a 2nd Lt. in their Army.

A realatively clean version of the Naval Insignia.

Kevin in Deva

[Kev in Deva]

And finaly the ribbon for the Italian 1915 - 1918 Victory Medal with one remaing pressed metal star, where originaly there were four stars.

And the Silver Bullion Star for the collars of the uniform.

Kevin in Deva.

Edited May 3, 2007 by Kev in Deva