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Hi ,

Could anyone tell me if any Kaiserliche marine (imperial navy aprox 1913) tally bands of ww1 were in gold lettering. I thought they were all in silver, example SMS EMDEN.

Any information would be apreciated.

Kevin R

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Hello Kevin,

in the 1870s the branches of the imperial german navy were completely divided in a nautical and a technical ressort. All personal serving " on deck " like seamen, gunners aso were trained at the so called Matrosendivision, all technicl like stokers, mechanics, craftsmen aso were trained at the Werftdivision. In 1884 uniform regulations were changed and from that time all personal from the Werftdivisions (1st in Kiel, 2nd in Wilhelmshaven) had to wear silver coloured buttons, metall-sleeve-badges and also silver-lettered cap ribbons. This stated until the end of the imperial navy in November 1918.

The letters in the ribbons were first woven with genuine silver wire and around 1900 silver was changed for aluminium that does not get dark by oxydation.

The personal from the Matrosendivision wore all badges and letters in gold. Later formed formations like Torpedodivision, Luftschiffabteilung, Minenabteilung, Unterseebootsdivision... were splitted also in nautical and technical personal. So a sailor, trained at the Unterseebootsdivision wore golden letters, a stoker silver (aluminium) letters.

We have written a nice little book about all this, 440 pages and 1200 pictures about german cap ribbons until 1918... but only available in german.

Regards

Markus Bodeux

Hi ,

Could anyone tell me if any Kaiserliche marine (imperial navy aprox 1913) tally bands of ww1 were in gold lettering. I thought they were all in silver, example SMS EMDEN.

Any information would be apreciated.

Kevin R

Edited by NavalMark

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Thank you Marcus,

i'm still alittle unclear, so if i had a SMS EMDEN cap with gold letters and marked 1913 it would be ok. is that right.

Kevin.

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Hello Kevin,

yes, you are right. Until 1918 golden and silver letters were worn mixed on board of every ship. The colour is indicating the branch of the man.

From mid 1916 until the end of war cap ribbons were also produced with letters from yellow or white artificial silk to save the metals gold, copper and aluminium.

Perhaps you can show the ribbon, there are also some reproductions on the market. How is it marked 1913 ?

Best regards

Markus

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I haven't seen it at the moment. it was described to me by a seller, he is going to send me some photo's before i decide to buy.

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Thanks again for your help Marcus, you have been a great help.i'm very pleased that it may be ok.....the seller is an honourable man and i would have been very dissapointed if it wasn't correct. i will wait for the photo's.

Regards,

Kevin.

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Hello Kevin,

here an example for the stamp in a white-one-piece cap from 1890. It shows the letter B A W for Bekleidungsamt Wilhelmshaven, the date and the size from 1-3, small, medium, large. Beside is a sewn in piece of cloth with the machine-stiched Name of the man.

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...and here an example for a wartime blue cap with sewn on top. B A K for Bekleidungsamt Kiel, the date and size in centimeters. Your 1913-cap should show this kind of stamp with the size in centimeters.

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..and a sailor from S.M.S. EMDEN, pic taken in Konstantinopel after returning. He has already received the Iron Cross 2nd class, the Liakat-medal in silver with swords and the Gallipoli Star. The tally is 100% with golden letters, silver would be much more shining like the white stripes on his collar.

It is Obermatrose Wilhelm S?ss.

Regards

CSForrester

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Thanks for the photo's Marcus,

They will be a great help to me, as i said , i will send you the photo's when they arrive........The EMDEN cap has great interest for me it was such a famous and courages ship and my Great Uncle was on HMAS SYDNEY when it destroyed the EMDEN the cap would go well in my collection with his SYDNEY items.

Regards,

Kevin.

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We have written a nice little book about all this, 440 pages and 1200 pictures about german cap ribbons until 1918... but only available in german.

Regards

Markus Bodeux

At A4 size with 443 pages, not so "little" :D

No naval collector should be without this book. It sets a benchmark for the subject that I cannot ever imagine being surpassed. It is absolutely awesome, a monumental work and one of my favourite reference books. I can't wait for the future coverage of the Reichsmarine, Kriegsmarine and Bundesmarine !

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Where can one procure a copy? I only have two cap ribbons (both on issue caps), but would still like to learn about the many other possibilities.

Chip

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Hi.

 

Can anyone tell me Kaiserliche Marine units was used Tellermütze with only marking Kaiserliche Marine on cap tally?

a1.jpg

On other Kaiserliche Marine Tellermütze tally i see name of units (ships).

Danke in advance

Schlange

m

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I may be wrong, but I've always believed those tally bands were used for ceremony's only, such as Funerals or honour guards, they represent the whole Kaiserliche Marine service, not just a particular Ship.

Maybe someone else has a better explanation.

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