Bryan Poon Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Dear AllCould anyone of you help for the infromation about this badge? I would like to know what's the clasp mean in this badge? How many combination of the clasps which will mounted on this badge?Thanks and regardsBP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scowen Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 As far as I'm aware the clasps show where the person had served.According to the award document there were 8 sets of clasps:Baltikum 1919/20Grenzschutz 1919/20Sparakus 1919/23Oberschlesien 1924Rhein-Ruhr 1923/24K?rnten 1919Rhein-Ruhr-GefangenerMitglied v?lkischer Kampfverb?nde 1922/23In his catalogue, Detlev shows one for the party (NSDAP 1922/23), whether that is what was meant by Mitglied v?lkischer Kampfverb?nde I do not know:CheersDon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 More info in German from Militaria-lexikon.de. If any translations are needed let me knowDas SchlageterschildGestiftet am 26.Mai 1933 vom Schlageter-Ged?chtnis-Bund in Hannover, als "Ehren-Erinnerungs-Abzeichen" zum 10j?hrigen Jahrestag.Die Schilder sind mit "Kampfschnallen" best?ckt, welche den Tr?ger als "aktiven" K?mpfer ausweisen.Diese Schilde haben dazu auch als Kennzeichnung die aufgelegten Schwerter im unteren Teil des Schildes.Ohne Schwerter wurden die Schilde an Rhein- und Ruhrgefangene verliehen, die durch ein Kriegsgericht verurteilt wurden und bedingt durch ihre Haft, nicht aktiv am Geschehen teilnehmen konnten.Diese Schilde sind selten zu finden!Es gab insgesamt 8 Kampfspangen1. Grenzschutz 1919/202. Baltikum 1919/203. Spartakus 1919/234. Rhein/Ruhr 1919/235. Rhein/Ruhr 1923/246. Oberschles. 19217. K?rnten 19198. NSDP 1922/23Wobei die letzten beiden Spangen relativ selten auf den Schilden zu finden sind!Das Schlageter Schild gab es in 3 Ausf?hrungen1. Form; Schildf?rmig ab Mai 19332. Form; Oval ab Juli 19343. Form; Rund ab M?rz 1935Weshalb das Schild dreimal die Form gewechselt hat, l??t sich nicht genau erkl?ren!Es gab Differenzen zwischen dem Schlageterbund und des Reichministers, sp?ter mit den Nazionalsozialisten, bez?glich dieser Organisation. Einerseits war der Schlageterbund keine anerkannte Freikorpstruppe, anderseits sah sich der Bund als Deckorganisation der NSDAP. Diese erkannte das Schlageterschild dennoch nicht als "Ehrenzeichen" der NSDAP an!Im Jahr 1936 wurde der Schlageter-Ged?chtnis-Bund aufgel?st.Das Tragen der Schilde wurde aufgrund des Gesetzses ?ber Titel, Orden und Ehrenzeichen verboten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted July 29, 2008 Author Share Posted July 29, 2008 As far as I'm aware the clasps show where the person had served.According to the award document there were 8 sets of clasps:Baltikum 1919/20Grenzschutz 1919/20Sparakus 1919/23Oberschlesien 1924Rhein-Ruhr 1923/24K?rnten 1919Rhein-Ruhr-GefangenerMitglied v?lkischer Kampfverb?nde 1922/23In his catalogue, Detlev shows one for the party (NSDAP 1922/23), whether that is what was meant by Mitglied v?lkischer Kampfverb?nde I do not know:CheersDonHi DonThank you very much.CheersBryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted July 29, 2008 Author Share Posted July 29, 2008 More info in German from Militaria-lexikon.de. If any translations are needed let me knowDas SchlageterschildGestiftet am 26.Mai 1933 vom Schlageter-Ged?chtnis-Bund in Hannover, als "Ehren-Erinnerungs-Abzeichen" zum 10j?hrigen Jahrestag.Die Schilder sind mit "Kampfschnallen" best?ckt, welche den Tr?ger als "aktiven" K?mpfer ausweisen.Diese Schilde haben dazu auch als Kennzeichnung die aufgelegten Schwerter im unteren Teil des Schildes.Ohne Schwerter wurden die Schilde an Rhein- und Ruhrgefangene verliehen, die durch ein Kriegsgericht verurteilt wurden und bedingt durch ihre Haft, nicht aktiv am Geschehen teilnehmen konnten.Diese Schilde sind selten zu finden!Es gab insgesamt 8 Kampfspangen1. Grenzschutz 1919/202. Baltikum 1919/203. Spartakus 1919/234. Rhein/Ruhr 1919/235. Rhein/Ruhr 1923/246. Oberschles. 19217. K?rnten 19198. NSDP 1922/23Wobei die letzten beiden Spangen relativ selten auf den Schilden zu finden sind!Das Schlageter Schild gab es in 3 Ausf?hrungen1. Form; Schildf?rmig ab Mai 19332. Form; Oval ab Juli 19343. Form; Rund ab M?rz 1935Weshalb das Schild dreimal die Form gewechselt hat, l??t sich nicht genau erkl?ren!Es gab Differenzen zwischen dem Schlageterbund und des Reichministers, sp?ter mit den Nazionalsozialisten, bez?glich dieser Organisation. Einerseits war der Schlageterbund keine anerkannte Freikorpstruppe, anderseits sah sich der Bund als Deckorganisation der NSDAP. Diese erkannte das Schlageterschild dennoch nicht als "Ehrenzeichen" der NSDAP an!Im Jahr 1936 wurde der Schlageter-Ged?chtnis-Bund aufgel?st.Das Tragen der Schilde wurde aufgrund des Gesetzses ?ber Titel, Orden und Ehrenzeichen verboten.Hi TazThank you. I like to see more information about this. I will try to translate it by online translator.CheersBryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted July 29, 2008 Author Share Posted July 29, 2008 Online translator give me the feeling of all words........... :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 Online translator give me the feeling of all words........... Not to worry Bryan, here is a quick translation, best I can do right now i'm a little pushed for time,Hope this helps you.The SchlagetershieldInstituted on the 26th May 1933 by the Schlageter memorial foundation in Hannover, as an Honoury Memorial badge for the 10th anniversary.On the badge various bars could be mounted and on the bottom swords, which signified that the recipient was an active fighter.Badges without swords were awarded to Rhein and Ruhr prisoners who were charged by a Military court martial, and because they were imprisoned unable to take part in the fighting.These badges are considered rare and hard to find.There were 8 Kampfspangen1. Grenzschutz 1919/20 (Border Security)2. Baltikum 1919/203. Spartakus 1919/234. Rhein/Ruhr 1919/235. Rhein/Ruhr 1923/246. Oberschlesien. 19217. K?rnten 19198. NSDP 1922/23The last two are rarer than the others.There were three types of Schlagetershield1.Form; Shield-shaped from May 19332. Form; Oval from July 19343. Form; Round from March 1935As to why the shield shape was changed three times, it is not exactly known. However there were differences in opinion with the Reichminister and later with the National socialists about the organisation. On the one side it was not a recognised Freikorpstruppe, on the other, the foundation saw itself as a cover organisation of the NSDAP. Even so the NSDAP did not recognise the Schlagetershield as one of their Honoury badges.In 1936 the Schlageter Memorial Foundation was dissolved and because of the laws on the wearing of Titles, Orders and Honoury medals/badges were no longer allowed to be worn.Regards Eddie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted July 30, 2008 Author Share Posted July 30, 2008 Not to worry Bryan, here is a quick translation, best I can do right now i'm a little pushed for time,Hope this helps you........Regards EddieDear EddieThanks for your great help. Very useful:- prove again, human translation is the best. - clarify the meaning of bottom swords- understand more the background of the badgeThe description in this site is much better than other sites I watched. Thanks again.All the bestBryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Dear Eddie- clarify the meaning of bottom swordsAll the bestBryanYour welcome Bryan,The sentance should read:"On the badge various bars could be mounted and on the bottom of the badge, swords"On the bottom of the badge, below the wording Schlageter, there are crossed swords. These signify that the recipient took part in active fighting.Rhein/Ruhr badges were awarded without those swords to those imprisoned during the times the fighting took place.Regards Eddie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Bear in mind that these badges were SOLD to people by the Schlageter memorial folks, just like all the thousands of vanity self-purchase WW1 veterans awards from the same period. They raised money by selling badges.How seriously--if at all--the sellers "checked out" the buyers, we may never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted August 5, 2008 Author Share Posted August 5, 2008 Rhein/Ruhr badges were awarded without those swords to those imprisoned during the times the fighting took place.Rhein/Ruhr badges came without sword.....um....I have one with 2 pairs of clasps "Grenzschutz 1919-20" and "Rhein/Rhur 1923-24". This example is came with a pair of swords. I think this pair of swards is due to the clasps "Grenzschutz 1919-20".During finding the information for Schlageter Badge, I found one of the US dealers mentioned that Schlageter Badge is difficult to get one and much scarce nowaday. He/she say that he can easily find over 1000 EKII and hard to find 1 Schlageter Badge...is this possible and real? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted August 5, 2008 Author Share Posted August 5, 2008 How seriously--if at all--the sellers "checked out" the buyers, we may never know.Verify a buyer or gain the money from he/she?I will choose the second one first for sure :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 (edited) Rhein/Ruhr badges came without sword.....um....I have one with 2 pairs of clasps "Grenzschutz 1919-20" and "Rhein/Rhur 1923-24". This example is came with a pair of swords. I think this pair of swards is due to the clasps "Grenzschutz 1919-20".During finding the information for Schlageter Badge, I found one of the US dealers mentioned that Schlageter Badge is difficult to get one and much scarce nowaday. He/she say that he can easily find over 1000 EKII and hard to find 1 Schlageter Badge...is this possible and real?Hello again Bryan,As I understand the text, there could be two versions of the Rhein/Ruhr badges.One has the swords:= For combatOne hasn't: = non-combatRegards Eddie. Edited August 5, 2008 by Taz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Poon Posted August 5, 2008 Author Share Posted August 5, 2008 Hello again Bryan,As I understand the text, there could be two versions of the Rhein/Ruhr badges.One has the swords:= For combatOne hasn't: = non-combatRegards Eddie.Hello EddieThanks a lot for the clarification.RegardsBryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 This might be of interest to the collectors of this awardhttp://stirnpanzer.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=642 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nesredep Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Hello!Amazing rare badge,congrats. :rolleyes: All the best Nesredep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Stahlhut Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 WONDERFUL BADGES. The great rarity is the large one, also the small round without swords. The larger one without swords is extreemly rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nesredep Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Hello!EricAmazing find. :jumping: :jumping: All the best Nesredep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Macleod Posted May 28, 2019 Share Posted May 28, 2019 There are 12 Kampfspangen I am aware of: Baltikum 1919/20 Baltikum 1919/23 Spartakus 1919/23 Grenzschutz 1919/20 Grenzschutz Kärnten 1919 O./Schlesien 1921 O./Schlesien 1922 Rhein/Ruhr 1919/23 Rhein/Ruhr 1923/24 NSDAP 1919/1923 NSDAP 1923/24 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambert Posted May 30, 2023 Share Posted May 30, 2023 AND NSDAP 1922/1923 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graf Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 On 01/03/2009 at 10:50, nesredep said: Hello! Eric Amazing find. All the best Nesredep I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashley58 Posted July 3, 2023 Share Posted July 3, 2023 Hi, here is my badge with 2 bars, Grenschutz 1919/1920 and Spartakus 1919/1923. enjoy 🙂 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambert Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 🤩 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graf Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 On 04/07/2023 at 01:00, ashley58 said: Hi, here is my badge with 2 bars, Grenschutz 1919/1920 and Spartakus 1919/1923. enjoy 🙂 Lovely Badge indeed 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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