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I guess he might have had a "Schnalle" which was worn under the bar, not on it ... :blush:

Yes, this was also my first thought...

Only a prussian long-service award is possible...he was from Lippe not from Saxony, there is no doubt.

But which prussian award, which was worn as "Schnalle", is possible?

He served 1870/71 and was in 1907 still alive, maybe still serving (no earlier award then 1871).

Greetings

Solomon

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No, I meant I can CROSS OFF all the "suspects" who HAD a Kriegervereinskreuz, since he doesn't. But that only eliminated 12 of them.

Thanks for information on "why" the Xs are on there! I have copies of the Statutes and there is no mention. :beer:

A lot of the Silver Cross 1870-71 recipients weren't career soldiers so they only would have been eligible for a Prussian LD2.

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To keep the thread going, and also because it's a nice photo, and I think one of the few I've seen of a Leopold-Orden in wear.

Hehe, nice photo of Leopold IV. prince of Lippe-Detmold.

He is also wearing a star of the House Order Lippe-Detmold...

Greetings

Solomon

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Hi Rick,

you want to see my Lippe bars - here's the first...

Wow, very nice NC-medalbar (although the war merit cross has a combatant-ribbon...) with a rare cross of the Leopold-Order

Do you know the former owner? Was it a doctor?

You MUST show us the rest of your Lippe bars :love:

Greetings

Solomon

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Agh. Of the 214 Inhaber Leopolds, I can immediately throw out about 35 (other awards, dead, returned...) but they are the sort of people NOT found in the Orders Almanac! So I have all their names, but can NOT discover what other awards almost all of them had. :banger:

What is the little medal on the green ribbon in last place?

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Mike-- thanks! I have not worked down to looking up the Leopold Inhabers in the Orders Almanac (I am still transcribing House Order grades) but there is a very good chance if that was from before 1908, and he listed himself in the Orders Almanac, that THAT could be the key to identifying Werner's medal bar recipient. :beer:

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Mike-- thanks! I have not worked down to looking up the Leopold Inhabers in the Orders Almanac (I am still transcribing House Order grades) but there is a very good chance if that was from before 1908, and he listed himself in the Orders Almanac, that THAT could be the key to identifying Werner's medal bar recipient. :beer:

Hi Rick,

that's good - go on work...

And here my next Lippe-bar

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There are 32 NCOs from Inf Rgt 55 who might have had the Silver Leopold Order Medal bar, out of 331. The key to that is the Lippe MVM, which should have been RETURNED after the naughty man got his EK2 and LKr. Solomon here may have the list of recipients for that, but I don't. We'd need to cross off suspects from the 32:

Beckmann, Adolf

Berger, Karl

Birkh?user, Adolf

Borck, Bruno

Brinkmann, Konrad

Dargatz, Arthur

Eggert, Wilhelm

Facklam, August

Frehsdorf, Fritz

Gersberg, Thomas

Gossing, Fritz

Hollmann, Gustav

H?tte, Karl

Jungeblut, Otto

Knickrehm, Friedrich

Kornfeld, Gustav

Kuhfuss, Wilhelm

Mengert, Friedrich

Minner, Heinrich

Puhle, Richard

Rose, Friedrich

Saling, Carl

Schaare, August

Schl?ter, August

Schneider, Gustav

Sch?ning, Heinrich

Thiele, Max

T?lle, Carl

Tr?ger, Ernst

Vetter, Paul

V?ltz, Paul

Wolfram, Carl

I have no notation for anybody a Mecklenburg-Schwerin Wend Crown Gold Merit Cross ( :love: ) so if you already know that guy's name, tell me and I'll tell you the award date for his LDH4b. The only railways station supervisor old enough for 1870 without an Orders Almanac entry is Emil Zwarg, so I have nothing on him but his LDH4b data.

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Thank you Mike Dwyer.

While the center medallion leaves a bit to be desired, I think that the real significance of this little piece is the way in which the translucent blue enamel in the arms has been replicated.

While we?re on the subject, following is a piece, home for a short visit, which has been posted before; but I think, at least for the benefit of new members, is worth posting again. In this case, at 31.27 mm, we have a prinzen or reduction (can anyone accurately differentiate these two terms?) example of the House Order officer's cross with swords.

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Hi WNickle,

As a longtime Brunswick collector, I have to say that your bar in post #89 is the most unique I?ve ever seen. :love: Do you know who the recipient is?

Congratulations and best wishes, :cheers:

Wild Card

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Excellent Werner! :jumping::jumping: That fills in an "invisible" guy. :jumping::jumping: But even if you have ALL his Urkunden, I bet none of them have his birth information:

LDH4b #58 per 19.11.1912--

Emil Zwarg, Oberbahnhofsvorsteher Berlin-Charlottenburg

drumroll for Werner

geboren Guben 25 September 1851. :catjava:

MINI LDH-OX!!!! :speechless1: But there were only 37 of them! :speechless1: Actually, I am fairly certain that three awards, 30.5.18, 11.11.18, and 12 (!).11.18 are defective and should have been NO Xs-- so 34 accurately. :rolleyes:

They were all "working folk," Majors mostly, so not the sort of social exotics who should have had more than they could fit to wear. Wow.

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There are 32 NCOs from Inf Rgt 55 who might have had the Silver Leopold Order Medal bar, out of 331. The key to that is the Lippe MVM, which should have been RETURNED after the naughty man got his EK2 and LKr. Solomon here may have the list of recipients for that, but I don't.

I?m sorry, I don?t have the names for the MVM with swords...(1945 awards!). I have only some names for the medal without X.

But you are absolutely right. After awarding the merit cross LD, he had to return his MVM. But many didn?t...

The ID won?t be easy, to many possibilities.

Greetings

Solomon

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ONLY 1,945? That ain't naaawwwwwthing! :rolleyes: I've just finished filling in missing names and dates on the LDH2s of all types today... on to the LDH1s and the two grades of Verdienstkreuz.

So MANY awards...

and yet so many of them were RETURNED :speechless1::speechless1::speechless1::rolleyes:

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I found this old thing laying about!

"SPM"

:speechless1::speechless1::speechless1:

Your are kidding, don?t you?

These long service bars are very,very rare and were awarded only a short time (1857-1868)...71 awards for this one (20 years).

Greetings

Solomon

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