Chris Boonzaier Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Has anyone found the official statutes regarding either of the badges? They must have been officially approved, not just verbally by the kaiser.. these would then have been published and diseminated... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Boonzaier Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 The reason I asked about the giving out of the badge... in my limited experiance "newbies" are often regarded with a bit of hostility in units... and they need to prove themselves before being accepted. Often they replace a liked and experianced comrade, and they appear all fresh and pimply and full of the eagerness and bravado and mouthiness... and the old hands stick together and wait to see how the Newbie turns out. When I was in the army the new guys had to have at least one overseas operation before they could open their mouths and be somewhat accepted. That is why I was wondering that if within the unit you had to "prove yourself" before you were allowed to wear the badge. I.E. if some guy who had fought for months at Verdun and wore his badge with pride... what would he think if the same badge was worn by a guy the day he arrived at the unit. Same way I think the US 1st Cav division ives a Stetson to the guys who have done a tour, having "earned" their spurs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Boonzaier Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I would have to lean toward Gruss in contrast to Larcade, despite the latter being a nice book. Larcade is OK, but he sometimes jumps to conclusions and sells opinion as fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Boonzaier Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Gruss isn't infallible; he says in that quote that the flamethrower regiment wore a "silver" death's head. The death's head was silver only for officers. The men wore a gray death's head. There's also a white death's head of a different pattern. But to say that all flamethrower pioneers wore a silver death's head is inaccurate. I think there are plenty of precedents in German badge making where gray is substituted for silver... Officers having silver bullion and other ranks having white or grey cotton... I think we would need the oficial statute here. best Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas W Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 When I was in the army the new guys had to have at least one overseas operation before they could open their mouths and be somewhat accepted. That is why I was wondering that if within the unit you had to "prove yourself" before you were allowed to wear the badge. I.E. if some guy who had fought for months at Verdun and wore his badge with pride... what would he think if the same badge was worn by a guy the day he arrived at the unit. I think this photo proves that simply joining the unit made you eligible for the sleeve badge. Unless of course this... baby was in reality a stone-cold killer in disguise. Look how he's crunched up his cap and wears it at a jaunty angle to try and prove he's a veteran. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas W Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Another baby flamethrower pioneer. The seller told me he was from the flamethrower platoon of Assault Battalion No. 5 (Rohr). There's no proof of that, except for maybe the relatively high position of the sleeve badge. Clearly the badges were awarded to anyone who joined the units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 The last dozen or so posts .............. what a fascinating exchange of views. I thought (in my blissful ignorance) that things were pretty well 'cut and dried' with the FW/TK badges. Obviously not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 The reason I asked about the giving out of the badge... in my limited experiance "newbies" are often regarded with a bit of hostility in units... and they need to prove themselves before being accepted. That is why I was wondering that if within the unit you had to "prove yourself" before you were allowed to wear the badge. I.E. if some guy who had fought for months at Verdun and wore his badge with pride... what would he think if the same badge was worn by a guy the day he arrived at the unit. As Thomas already mentioned - everyone in the Regiment was entitled to wear the Totenkopf, for the duration of the war, on the sleeve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Permission to wear the totenkopf ............ but nothing about the COLOUR of the TK !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Permission to wear the totenkopf ............ but nothing about the COLOUR of the TK !! Correct! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Correct! Dum spiro spero !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 (edited) Dum spiro spero !! Reddeman mentions in the prolog of his book: "That the former members of the GRPR will proudly wear in their veterans clubs the silver Totenkopf on their civilian jackets." Edited January 17, 2011 by Naxos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Reddeman mentions in the prolog of his book: "That the former members of the GRPR will proudly wear in their veterans clubs the silver Totenkopf on their civilian jackets." GOOD INFORMATION !! Another example of the period use of UNOFFICIAL FW TKs !! :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas W Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Reddeman mentions in the prolog of his book: "That the former members of the GRPR will proudly wear in their veterans clubs the silver Totenkopf on their civilian jackets." I'm pretty sure that means a metal lapel pin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Reddeman mentions in the prolog of his book: "That the former members of the GRPR are proudly wearing in their veterans clubs the silver Totenkopf on their civilian jackets." Correction: ...are proudly wearing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I'm pretty sure that means a metal lapel pin. Agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 I'm pretty sure that means a metal lapel pin. I agree. Like this .............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Or this ............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 798 Replies 19,755 Views :jumping: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 There were SOOOOOO ............. many lapel TKs !! :cheeky: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas W Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Flamethrower officer's silver sleeve badge. It appears to have a shadow on the upper right edge of the skull, which could mean that this is a metal badge. Never heard of that before... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Lumsden Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 Flamethrower officer's silver sleeve badge. It appears to have a shadow on the upper right edge of the skull, which could mean that this is a metal badge. Never heard of that before... The officer one on display at the Rastatt museum is in fine silver bullion thread ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas W Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 (edited) The officer one on display at the Rastatt museum is in fine silver bullion thread ........... True, but this one looks like a one-piece white-metal badge. It seems to be casting a shadow. Also, it's very bright in comparison to the other officers' badges I've seen. Somewhere in this massive thread are shots of officers wearing the bullion badge, which photographs as a light gray. Maybe this guy went out and had himself a metal badge cast privately. It's a wartime photo, not a postwar image. Edited January 18, 2011 by Thomas W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Boonzaier Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 I think this photo proves that simply joining the unit made you eligible for the sleeve badge. Unless of course this... baby was in reality a stone-cold killer in disguise. Look how he's crunched up his cap and wears it at a jaunty angle to try and prove he's a veteran. Maybe he is already a veteran? 6 Months at the front would not have aged him overnight. Plenty of baby faces on photos wearing an EK. Best Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naxos Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 (edited) ... thought we could use a laugh ..... http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/ww1-german-ersatz-spike-picklehaube-helmet . Edited January 18, 2011 by Naxos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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