The Queen's South Africa Medal 1899-1902

[Hendrik]

Hello All,

This medal is certainly amongst my favourites as far as British campaign medals go. Besides having lots of possible bar combinations which makes it a collector's dream, I'm also aware that different versions exist which can be identified on the medal's reverse :

1. Britannia holding the wreath to the letter "R" in Africa with underneath the dates 1899-1900

2. Same but with dates removed but still visible, aka "ghost dates"

3. Britannia holding the wreath to the letter "F" in Africa (no dates) and

4. "Mediterranean" instead of "South Africa".

Of the first issue it would appear less than 70 were ever awarded and only to one unit, Lord Strathcona's Horse. Has anyone ever seen such a medal and, even more interesting, taken a picture of it which can be posted here ? I'd love to see one

Here's one with the Mediterranean reverse :

[attachmentid=17468]

[Ed_Haynes]

A nice one, for sure. And one of the few Victorian medals that are still, marginally, affordable. Yet, for my collecting interests (Indian Army), they are immensely uncommon, as the use of Indian troops in South Africa was avoided, largely for "racial" reasons.

One nice pair in my custody (shown elsewhere and repeated here):

885 Sowar Naurang Singh, Patiala Imperial Service Lancers

1- Queen's South Africa - CAPE COLONY, ORANGE FREE STATE, TRANSVAAL - 885 SOWAR NAURANG SINGH. PATIALA LCRS.

2- King's South Africa - SA 01, SA 02 - 885 SOWAR NAURANG SINGH. PATIALA LCRS.

[Tony Farrell]

Example of a 'ghost dated' reverse.

[Hendrik]

Hello Tony,

Gorgeous one ! Am I correct in saying that yours is a renamed medal or one with the naming erased ?

[Chris Boonzaier]

Here you go... the only set of Boer war medals to a boonzaier... and he was on the baddies side!

My whole life long I have had to put up with people not knowing how topronounce my name... or how to spell it... and on the QSA... the name is wrong.. Broonzaier instead of Boonzaier

I have a complicated family tree I found online... this guy must be an uncle of some sort... if anyone knows how to read these trees, give me a shout!

[Chris Boonzaier]

a nice one to an Argyl and Sutherland highlander... Modder river, Magersfontein etc...

[Chris Boonzaier]

same one

[Chris Boonzaier]

Here are 2.

The one is to this guy

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=3339

The other to Private A.J. joubert of the Graaff-Reinet town guard.

Like my relative above, he was a Cape Afrikaaner who was not to impressed with the cousins from over the border.

[Chris Boonzaier]

Here are two more.

The 6 bar is nice because it is mainly battle bars, also to an Afrikaaner. Trooper H.T. Coetzee of Kitcheners Horse, am not sure if he had a KSA.

the other is not to a South African although he settled in South Africa after the war.

He was a Scot, Surgeon J.A. Robertson.

[Tony]

Here you go... the only set of Boer war medals to a boonzaier... and he was on the baddies side!

If he was on the bad guy's side how was he awarded British medals?

Tony

[Tony Farrell]

Am I correct in saying that yours is a renamed medal or one with the naming erased ?

No, it's just the image that makes it look a bit thin at the 6 O'clock: the naming's fine. It's part of a TF pair to a Serjeant in the Loyals (North Lancashires).

[Chris Boonzaier]

If he was on the bad guy's side how was he awarded British medals?

Tony

[Hendrik]

No, it's just the image that makes it look a bit thin at the 6 O'clock: the naming's fine. It's part of a TF pair to a Serjeant in the Loyals (North Lancashires).

Very nice indeed Tony ! Noticing the SA 1901 bar on the QSA, can you enlighten me on what could be the reason the Serjeant wasn't awarded the KSA as well ?

[Tony Farrell]

Because he's already got a 1901 clasp on his QSA. SA01 & 02 clasped QSAs are not accompanied by a KSA. To be eligible for the 1902 clasp for the QSA, one had to have served at the 'front' between the 1st January & 31st May 1902. Five months. To be eligible for the KSA, one had to have served for eighteen months before the 1st June, 1902. Basically the 1902 bar for the QSA was for those who were 'short timers' and the KSA for the blokes who'd been in theatre for at over a year & half.

[Ed_Haynes]

2435 Dafadar Partab Singh, 11th King Edward?s Own Lancers (Probyn?s Horse)

1- Durbar 1911, silver - unnamed

Awarded Durbar 1911 Medal per IA list (p. 154 of roll) as "2435 Dafadar Partab Singh, 11th King Edward's Own Lancers (Probyn's Horse)" from Civil Allottment, list from the Military Secretary to the Viceroy - 172 to the regiment.

2- Queen's South Africa Medal, 1899-1902 - SOUTH AFRICA 1902 - 2435 SOWAR PURTAB SINGH. 11TH BENGAL LCRS.

Verified on roll. Medal issued 29 December 1902, bar on 17 February 1903.

Not known if this is a complete entitlement.

[Hendrik]

Because he's already got a 1901 clasp on his QSA. SA01 & 02 clasped QSAs are not accompanied by a KSA. To be eligible for the 1902 clasp for the QSA, one had to have served at the 'front' between the 1st January & 31st May 1902. Five months. To be eligible for the KSA, one had to have served for eighteen months before the 1st June, 1902. Basically the 1902 bar for the QSA was for those who were 'short timers' and the KSA for the blokes who'd been in theatre for at over a year & half.

Many thanks Tony for this information !!!

[bigjarofwasps]

Smashing thread!!!!

Here`s a few more examples, which might be of interest.

Whilst I`m on the subject has any else noticed the varing widths in the rim, on the face of these medals?

Also the difference in the postion of where the clasp is attached to the medal?

Although these medals to a certain extent where mass produced at the time, there all slighty different.

[bigjarofwasps]

I have several examples all to the Yeomanry. Some are named to Troop others to Private, even though there all named to the same unit?

A few that of of particular interest is one to a Yeoman who was presented with it personally by the King. One to Yeoman from my village, and another whose horse rolled on him, he later died of entric fever whilst on campaign. I also have one to a Yeoman who was wounded in the knee.

I think I`ll agree that this medal is one of my favourites, and the fact that theres so much scope for research, makes them even more inviting!!!

[bigjarofwasps]

[bigjarofwasps]

[Tony Farrell]

The IY LSM pair is worthy of a larger scan. Do you have many IY LSMs? I gather from your avatar that you're ex-QOMY?

[bigjarofwasps]

I`ll give it a bash (enlarging picture).

Not ex-QOMY, ex-RAMC currently in the process of enlisting in the RMLY.

[bigjarofwasps]

Sorry, when I blow the picture up, it looses all its detail.

Phil Burman has 2 YLGC medals on his list.....

559. Imperial Yeomanry Long Service. Edw. V11. Trumpeter T. Lawton. Cheshire I.Y. Awarded Feb. 1905. Listed

in the 1897 Muster Roll of the Congleton Troop. (NEF) ?450

560. Imperial Yeomanry Long Service. Edw. V11. Cpl. J. Shufflebotham. Cheshire I.Y. Awarded Feb. 1905.

Heavily polished. (Fine) ?295

I`d very much like them, but my purse won`t stretch that far, just out of interest how much research protentional is there for these medals? I have a nominal roll for 1897, which has Trum Lawton on it, but do they have service papers?

[andy]

My small contribution to this thread. First up is a small croup to Captain Barradell of the Army Pay corps.

[andy]

Pte Pardoe-Royal Warwick.Regt.