Austria-Hungary Signum Laudis for generals

[bovec1313]

I have a Medal for Military Merits, Militaerverdienstmedaille, popularly called ''Signum laudis'', a privately made example for generals. Namely, reverse is made from a special white bakelite-like plastic. Generals had namely white parade uniforms and medal made of bronze would after some time left a dark stain on the uniform. Bottom of reverse has small hallmark ''PATENT''.

Similar is Signum Memoriea medal, for 50 years anniversary of Franz Joseph on the throne, as well with plastic reverse. Medal is placed in box of producer Johan Maurer from Vienna

I would appreciate if somebody would tell what exact is the material on reverse and appropriate English and German word.

Edited April 13, 2010 by bovec1313

[bovec1313]

reverse

[bovec1313]

''Signum Memoriae'' Medal, obverse

[bovec1313]

''Signum memoriea'' medal, reverse

[bovec1313]

''Signum memoriae'' Medal, box. Obverse of the lid has no markings.

[Iver]

In the phaleristic journal SIGNUM Nr.4/december 2008 is an article about "SIGNVM MEMORIAE" and there is on tab.II a picture of this medal, "which rear side is made of white plastic. These medals are light (weight), made of striked in gild sheet metal, where the reverse side is made of white plastic"....

againe fantastic medals from your collection... I would also like to add a "plastic one" to my collection :D

[Yankee]

''Signum memoriea'' medal, reverse

Absolutely amazing. I also heard the stories of medals and decorations staining the white uniforms but never knew they did something about it on the medals. Never have seen anything like it before. Thanks for showing.

Sincerely

Brian

[sambolini]

Hi,

This is really very interesting. I have never heard of these. Thanks very much for posting.

Kind regards,

Sam

[Brian Wolfe]

There is a saying that you learn something new every day.

I guess they're correct.

An interesting post with some nice material to view.

Thanks for posting them.

Regards

Brian

[Yankee]

Just realized it can't be bakelite an early form of plastic. This stuff had not been invented yet. It only came to use in the 20's. Perhaps the reverse is a very fine enamel or porcelain.

[Iver]

Just realized it can't be bakelite an early form of plastic. This stuff had not been invented yet. It only came to use in the 20's. Perhaps the reverse is a very fine enamel or porcelain.

There were celluloid ribbons, maybe its also made of celluloid....

Edited April 14, 2010 by Iver

[Josef Rietveld]

thanks for showing. it's a shame but i haven't seen such variants before.

regards

josef

[Tom Y]

There were celluloid ribbons, maybe its also made of celluloid....

Celluloid makes the most sense. Put a match to it. If it burns it's celluloid, if it melts it's plastic. If it cracks it's porcelain :cheeky:

[Gordon Craig]

Gentlemen,

There was an earlier thread on this forum about Long Service awards that had material on the back of the medals so they would not mark the uniforms. I don't remember what the material material was that was used on the backs of the medals but it was definitely not plastic. I don't think that they were specifically for Generals either but I can not be sure of that.

Regards,

Gordon

[Josef Rietveld]

Gentlemen,

There was an earlier thread on this forum about Long Service awards that had material on the back of the medals so they would not mark the uniforms. I don't remember what the material material was that was used on the backs of the medals but it was definitely not plastic. I don't think that they were specifically for Generals either but I can not be sure of that.

Regards,

Gordon

dear gordon, we have been talking abbout mother of pearl, tortoise shell and enamel as far as i remember

regards

josef

[bovec1313]

Dear all,

thanks for interesting comments and suggections. I like Tom's one most:

''Celluloid makes the most sense. Put a match to it. If it burns it's celluloid, if it melts it's plastic. If it cracks it's porcelain''. Unfortunately I don't have to many of these medals to try to burn one or to crack it. But would be interesting...

It's (most likely) not enamel; it could't be formed like than. Enamel is liquid until not burned. Celluloid as well not. It might be a porcelain; but it's kind of ''warm'' touch under finger tips, while porcelain plates in my wife's kitchen are ''cold''. I've just tried both. And plastic was not invented yet...

Concerning Gordon's comment about generals; these medals were definitely made for white uniforms, as I've said, bronze reverse left stain on white uniform after some time. Namely, to have an ''extra'' reverse which normaly can't be seen has no (other) reason. But only generals had white tunics; tunics of all other ranks and branches were in color; infantry officers had dark blue, etc. And thus no visible stains.

regards, Pavel

[Josef Rietveld]

Dear Pavel as addition: The dorotheum in vienna offers a Kriegsmedaille 1873 with white backside in its actual auction (27th of May).

DOROTHEUM

regards

josef

Edited May 3, 2010 by Josef Rietveld

[bovec1313]

Thanks Josef;

I've got the catalogue few days ago; I'm only wandering what price will it realise....

[Josef Rietveld]

Dear Pavel as addition: The dorotheum in vienna offers a Kriegsmedaille 1873 with white backside in its actual auction (27th of May).

DOROTHEUM

regards

josef

my guess: 250 to 300 Euro

josef

[cimbineus]

Hi Gents,

I also would like to contribute to this interesting discussion, if I may. As a result of an "accident" I am in a position to share with you two photographs. My hope is that they will help us to answer the question about material. The word "PATENT" and the fact that bakelite was invented between 1907 and 1909 suggest me that the white material is most probably bakelite, after all. If this assumption is correct, we can set a time frame too, which would start in 1909 (the year when bakelite was patented) and 1918, the fall of the Austro-Hungarian Empire.

Regards,

cimbineus

Here is the first photograph:

[cimbineus]

... and here is the second one:

[bovec1313]

Thanks, cimbineus, to solve the mistery and tell us exactly what it is;

and great to see how does it look ''behind''.

Very interesting pics indeed

[Yankee]

... and here is the second one:

Hi Cimbineus

Glade it came out in one piece . Are you 100% certain it is bakelite? Is the reverse heavy or light? True it was invented in the early 1900's used for industrial & electrical applications. In the 1920's & 30's was widely used in consumer goods. What is most interesting are the cases. The case for the Signum Laudis is by Maurer. The case in the Dorotheum is by Tiller. It is difficult to imagine that two firms would both manufacture something so rare. Does anybody kmow these two firms had closed their doors for good? Also in the 20's the Austrian Generals used parade uniforms in white.

Sincerely

Yankee

[Yankee]

Hi Cimbineus

Glade it came out in one piece . Are you 100% certain it is bakelite? Is the reverse heavy or light? True it was invented in the early 1900's used for industrial & electrical applications. In the 1920's & 30's was widely used in consumer goods. What is most interesting are the cases. The case for the Signum Laudis is by Maurer. The case in the Dorotheum is by Tiller. It is difficult to imagine that two firms would both manufacture something so rare. Does anybody kmow these two firms had closed their doors for good? Also in the 20's the Austrian Generals used parade uniforms in white.

Sincerely

Yankee

Please excuse spelling mistake. When did these firms go out of business?

[Iver]

..I would say these two firms has just made the cases for medals, not the medals itself...