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Kings Royal Rifle Corps pillbox hat


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I have the chance of purchasing this Victorian era Kings Royal Rifle Corps pillbox hat.It comes in a hat tin with the Royal coat of arms embossed on top which has an accompanying label.Any comments on originality would be appreciatedc,cheers,

Paul

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Two things which strike me is (1)it isn't rifle green and (2)why has a shoulder title been attached??? I may be wrong, but a pillbox cap for the KRR in my opininion should be rifle green, with possibly a splash of red, their facing colour. I'll trawl about for some prints showing it being worn.

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I have looked at this one many times and then checked my DRs as I was suspicious of the crown and KRR title to the front.

I was also suspicious of the tin itself as these were normally for officers only by private purchase. I would not have expected a private to spend money on such an item. And why does it have the Royal Coat of Arms? I would have expected that for a unit that wore the RCoA say on its helmet plate.

The 1883 DRs onwards, I know they are for officers Graham wink.gif , state that no badge was worn on the forage cap so I did not buy this one. I doubt that the ORs would have been different in this repect.

I have read that Rifle Green was almost indistinguishable from black so that isn't a problem. In fact, in Jones & Co's catalogue of 1886 it has a note that Rifle Regiments could have their Colonial pattern sun helmets covered with black cloth rather than the more usual white. See the Cameronians thread started by Leigh for a good discussion on this.

Stuart

Edited by Stuart Bates
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Thanks for that Stuart.I finally got round to visiting the Royal Green Jackets Museum at Winchester yesterday (the wife loved it!lol).I got some pics of quite a few items including some pill box caps.They're not great what with the glare from the glass but I think you can get an idea of colour and decorative items.Most I believe, are officers caps and none carried any sort of badge,first ones from The Rifle Brigade,cheers,

Paul

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Paul,

in post #12 item 1 on the list is a 60th Tropical helmet. Was it a Colonial pattern and do you remember whether it was white, khaki or black?

And are the pillbox caps black or a very dark green?

Stuart

Edited by Stuart Bates
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I just read the description again and that paper label pasted to the interior is interesting. Why does it mention both headsize and the belt? A strange marriage.

It is typewritten and the first QWERTY typewriter with upper and lower case was the Remington 2 which started production in 1878. The first "visible" typewriter came in about 1895. "Visible" here meaning that the operator could see the characters as they were typed. I wonder when typewriters were introduced to the British Army. Certainly in 1891 Remington claimed that there were over 100,000 typewriters in use. But this is 7 years after the 1884 stamp on the chinstrap.

Just rambling a bit here. Having found the label any old belt could have been obtained and it doesn't look to be for a particularly "wide girth." I wear a size 38" belt for a size 32" waist and it, when wrapped around itself, seems to be about the same length as the one shown.

Anyway flogging a dead horse here as the crown and the KRR title are the killers.

Stuart

Edited by Stuart Bates
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Thanks for the input guys.I'm not sure what the label in the tin is supposed to be,a sort of issue form for requisitioned kit?The cap in the first pic is completely black and looks like the ones worn by the NCOs in the pic posted by Graham.The others are black and green.I took quite a few pics Stuart,including this one,enjoy.

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It just gets worse. The stitching of the top decoration is a bit wonky and is visible on the interior. Does this mean that ORs' caps did not have a lining?

Timothy, I see what you mean about its not being braid at all and officers had 8 loops of ornamentation not the 4 shown as Graham pointed out. Don't tell me that ORs' caps did not have 8 also?

Gad! we have exhumed the horse and flogged it some more blush.gif

Stuart

Edited by Stuart Bates
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