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Also Bill, staying on subject,

I would like to point out, this medal is not listed in Laslo's book. The Italian official type-3 has a twin official medal which was made and marked with a compact monogram from the firm, F.M. Lorioli & Castelli-Milano. Both the official type-3 & 3A medals are identical to each other except for the monogram used by Lorioli & Castelli.

In my book World War I, Victory Medals, I listed and illustrated this second medal as the official type-3A.

click photo to enlarge

Edited by johnnymac

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Jim, Rob,

Many thanks for your comments. The photos serve to confirm that I have two Official Type2s. On the left-hand medal in my post # 172 the dots between the words at the bottom are very small and difficult to see, but they are there. The detail on the urn that you highlight, Jim , is very much less clear than on the right-hand one, too, but I shall go back to looking for the Reissues.

Jim, both the medals I show have the curved line at the top that you mention, as does the Official Type 2 I've had for years.

I do have both the Lorioli & Castelli long and short varieties, however, so I don't need to look for those!

Bill

Edited by Bilco

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Bill,

Manufacturers made not one or two but several medals that were unknown by Laslo in 1992. We post many of these new medals on GMIC all the time.

From Laslo's book on the reissue type-1 he wrote, "Contemporary version By S. Johnson. Less detail than official issue." I find to be very vague.

Based on his description this medal I listed as the reissue type-1 and mentioned by him, fits his description. Also the last two medals in the third illustration are missing the dots between the E & D.

click to enlarge photo

Edited by johnnymac

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Hi Jim,

Is that a miniature? They came with all sorts of suspensions, from what I've seen.

Bill

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I did a google search, I then clicked the images and saw this, so I do not know. Miniature could be right as I do not collect them

Jim

Edited by johnnymac

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Jim,

On I did a google search, I then clicked images and saw this, so I do not know. Miniature could be right a I do not collect them

Jim

It is indeed a miniature. They are seen with ball suspenders as well as thick wire/cylinder type suspenders. They are seen n a variety of diameters much like the French miniatures.

Regards,

Rob

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Hi Gents,

 

I had something of a bonaza a week ago - I managed to acquire both the Reissue Type 1 and the Reissue Type 2, from different sources, within a couple of days. There are some interesting differences, both between the two of them and the Official Types:

 

 

italy2reissuestype1pair_zps64bcdefe.jpg

 

The Reissue Type 1. It has no dots between the lower 3 words at the bottom of the planchet reverse. The planchet is a coppery-bronze colour, with a thick staffa, but the most striking thing to me is how thin it is - 1.75mm, about half the Official Type. The detail is shallower than the Official types, and there are detail differences..

 

 

italy2reissuestype2pair_zpsa3559e48.jpg

 

 

The Reissue Type 2. It has no maker or designer naming on the obverse, and the upper lettering on the reverse has serifs, unlike the Official types. The planchet again has a coppery tint, and there has been artificial darkening around the detail, which is quite sharp. The planchet is thick, but the staffa is thin and rather short, compared to the Official types.

 

I've seen a couple of Italian vics which claim to have no manufacturer or designer naming, but the remains of incompletely erased lettering have still been visible, so I've turned them down.

 

I've been looking for the Reissue Type 1 for some time, so I was very pleased to find one, and even more pleased that the Type 2 appeared at the same time. At least those fruitless hours spent scanning the sites of on-line dealers have finally paid off!

 

All comments welcome.

 

Bill

Edited by Bilco

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Bill,

You have listed this italian vic as the reproduction type 4 in your book.

 

Noting that your comments indicate it was sand casting and marked 'Made in France' could you provide details of the provenance and background of this example?

Regards,
Rob

 

 

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Hi Rob

I think you are asking about my book and not Bill's book, am I correct?

The place of origin or the earliest history of this medal is unknown. Without the made in France stamp on the stirrup it would have been a total mystery.

Here a closer view of the medal, I hope this helps.

Regards, Jim

 

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New acquisition: the "short" variant of the Lorioli-Castelli version.

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Just acquired - from the obverse a rather time-worn Johnson Italy Vic Official Type 2 ...

italyindia%2001-crop_zpsgkmnpdtu.jpg

... but the reverse shows it's had another use ...

italyindia%2002-crop_zpsyk3hv4x2.jpg

It came to me from Pakistan, but there must be a tale on how it got there. Was it used as an ID tag for an Indian Army POW in Italy in WW2? Or a tool board tag? Is there any clue in the number under the name - does it match any particular Indian Army regiment or corps?

In any event, it's an intrigueing addition to the collection, and I'm wondering whether to put it on a ribbon or not. Any suggestions as to it's use?

 

Bill

 

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Here is my first offering to this section of the VM world .I believe it is a type 1 any observations will be greatly recieved 

 

WP_20150410_12_53_12_Pro.jpg

WP_20150410_12_53_20_Pro.jpg

hopefully more to come :)

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Just acquired - from the obverse a rather time-worn Johnson Italy Vic Official Type 2 ...

italyindia%2001-crop_zpsgkmnpdtu.jpg

... but the reverse shows it's had another use ...

italyindia%2002-crop_zpsyk3hv4x2.jpg

It came to me from Pakistan, but there must be a tale on how it got there. Was it used as an ID tag for an Indian Army POW in Italy in WW2? Or a tool board tag? Is there any clue in the number under the name - does it match any particular Indian Army regiment or corps?

In any event, it's an intrigueing addition to the collection, and I'm wondering whether to put it on a ribbon or not. Any suggestions as to it's use?

 

Bill

 

 
 
 
 

Hello Bill.

It is an interesting piece, I wonder how may have come to Pakistan or India. We will never know !! ..

I think it should be preserved that same way, just let it rest in a lined box. as I do with my medals without the Ribbon

 

Best

 

Lambert

 

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Here is my first offering to this section of the VM world .I believe it is a type 1 any observations will be greatly recieved 

 

WP_20150410_12_53_12_Pro.jpg

WP_20150410_12_53_20_Pro.jpg

hopefully more to come :)

 

Welcome Paul !!

 

Lambert

 

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Good day! My recent purchase of the Italian medals. Note the distance between «ORSOLINI MOD» and «F.M. LORIOLLI & CASTELLI MILANO ». As well as the presence of a point after the word «MOD» first medal. The other two medals is no point!

Италия Тип 3 FM LORIOLLI & CASTELLI MILANO О.jpg

Италия Тип 3 F.M. LORIOLLI & CASTELLI MILANO Официальный.jpg

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19 hours ago, oliver860 said:

Good day! My recent purchase of the Italian medals. Note the distance between «ORSOLINI MOD» and «F.M. LORIOLLI & CASTELLI MILANO ». As well as the presence of a point after the word «MOD» first medal. The other two medals is no point!

Hello Oliver,

You have managed to obtain all three of the sub-varieties of the Loriolli-Castelli version of the Italian vic.  Interestingly the bottom of the three examples is a bit more difficult to locate than the top two.

Regards,
Rob

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Does anyone know the status of the "landing victory" medal listed in Laslo's book?  He noted that it might have been an athletic award, which makes me wonder why he bothered including it at all, and I note it is not in Michels' book.  Has this one been shown to not be a victory medal?

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On 03/11/2016 at 18:42, davidck said:

Does anyone know the status of the "landing victory" medal listed in Laslo's book?  He noted that it might have been an athletic award, which makes me wonder why he bothered including it at all, and I note it is not in Michels' book.  Has this one been shown to not be a victory medal?

Hi

There is some image of it?

Lambert

20 hours ago, oliver860 said:

Hello!

My medal. Reissue Type 1

Regards, Oliver 

Италия аверс.jpg

Very good :) .. very sharp detail.

Lambert

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Hi Lambert, the one I'm actually talking about is Laslo's unofficial type 4, which is a completely different design from the regular Italian medals, and has a blank reverse.  He calls it "landing victory" in his table at the beginning of the Italy section of his book.

Edited by davidck
mistake about Laslo's descriptions

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Hi Davidck

At some time I posted something about models of the Victory Medals Italia, found in the Italian book on their medals (immagine Scarpa-Sézanne "Le decorazioni del Regno di Sardegna e del Regno d'Italia - Commemorative - vol.2" - Tav. 25 ) .. I believe they were not approved for manufacture. And it is possible that it has never been produced beforehand.

here

post-11061-0-11205000-1347491144.jpg

post-11061-0-45931900-1347491437.jpg


But I do not have more information about the "landing victory". I have a friend who is Italian and collector of Medals. I'll talk to him, maybe he might know something.

All the best

Lambert

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Liverpool Medals currently have a modern copy of this medal in their list ...

f66c43d2-581c-4a14-b539-01ccfa30bb91_zps

The reverse is completely blank - Laslo shows the original was engrailed - with a ring of 95 raised dots around the circumference - with the centre blank.

Liverpool Medals are asking £95 if you fancy a punt!

Bill

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20 hours ago, Bilco said:

Liverpool Medals currently have a modern copy of this medal in their list ...

f66c43d2-581c-4a14-b539-01ccfa30bb91_zps

The reverse is completely blank - Laslo shows the original was engrailed - with a ring of 95 raised dots around the circumference - with the centre blank.

Liverpool Medals are asking £95 if you fancy a punt!

Bill

Thanks Bill.  Is there any reason to think this was actually a victory medal?  Laslo doesn't seem very sure.

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