JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 Here is another classification of Golden Kites. This time I suggest we discuss in every detail 3rd class of Colden Kite order. This classification (created for 3rd class) has direct reference to 2nd class. We all know that until 1942 person awarded by 2nd class received a star and a sign on the 3rd class. As well as in the previous classification (see classification for 4 and 5 classes) at this classification three columns. Left – a photo of a kite. Central – my attribution of the piece to specific time period (Meiji –Taisho–Showa). Right – number under which the given type of a kite will be mentioned in our further discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Here it comes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 All three types have almost identical reverses. Position of rivets at all types almost identical. All three types also have almost identical diameter of rivets (except for one variation of type 2). Type 1 and type 2 each have at least two versions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 (edited) Here they are. Edited September 18, 2011 by JapanX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Now detailed (and this is not exaggeration!) photos obverses and reverses of all 5 types with my comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Type 1.1 Meiji Excellent early sign. Classics. It is quite interesting that out of four rivets only two on the left have thin long cuts. And the cuts on right rivets have a different geometry. They are a bit shorter and wider. Especially right bottom rivet. The subsequent types have more unified screws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Type 1.2 Meiji Excellent early sign. From the previous differs minor alteration of the form of a kites body (a neck and the bottom part) and its beak. Different execution of a pole. Other shades of enamel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Type 2.1 Meiji - Taisho Substantial change in the form of a wing and body of a kite. Larger diameter of rivets. Other shades of enamel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Type 2.2 Meiji - Taisho Change in form of a body of a kite. Wings remain practically unchanged. Note – 2.1 and 2.2 almost twins. But as, despite their similarity, the shade of enamels on a pole differs!!! Difference not less considerable (if no more), than between type 1.1 and 1.2. The same can be said about enamel color at bottom part of a harness! And photos 2.1 and 2.2 are made on the same technique under same condition! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Type 2.2 is extremely interesting by absolutely unusual (if not unique) execution of a beam at 12 o'clock. Beam in the top part is bent. To be exact – it is recurved. It is obvious that it is made for convenience of carrying of a sign (and not by the owner). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Type 3 Showa The most numerous type and quite unified. A sign, which colleagues’ observe at this scan, belonged to lieutenant general Kodzhiro Uchijama. Kodzhiro Uchijama was a holder of the 2nd class. He has been awarded in the early twentieth (somewhere between 1921-1926). Exactly in this form and execution badges of the 3rd class have existed until the 1945. As I have said earlier – this type the most homogeneous among all others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Here the different badge. Despite all differences in shooting it is visible that signs are identical in every detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Often = Showa | Rare = Meiji | Very rare = Taisho And again frequency of a meeting with that or other sign is put in a foundation of classification. Type 3 certainly dominates. This type occupies a time interval from the middle of 1920s and to the middle of 1940s. It can be found in the rare second degree on first half 20 and in a rectangular box for the third class with silver paint hieroglyphs. On the second place on frequency of occurrence there is type 1. Of course type 1 is much much scarcer than type 3. But nevertheless from time to time we run across this type. Beaten-broken, with erose top ray, threadbare gilding on a kite and sometimes simply without a pole with a kite … But you have a chance to meet him on the market. For me it is doubtless that type 1 served Russian-Japanese war. The badge which we come across less often is type 2. For all “my time” in Japanese Faleristics (yes! with capital letters!) I met this type only couple of times. During the same time period I observed more than a dozen passes of signs type 1. If someone or something has been awarded by the third or second class of a gold kite in an interval between 1905-1920 chances of are high that this award were type 2. But here again all rests against a problem of quantity of awards during Taisho epoch. If number 3000 is valid, than it is very probable that there was only few rewardings by 3rd class. Why I do not like figure around 3000 awards? Because there is an information about 3 awards by 1st class which were made during Taisho epoch! I simply can't believe that with three 1st class rewardings we got only 2997 rewardings in all other classes. It doesn’t seem right! I incline to think that type 1 and type 2 for some time existed in parallel and both participated in satisfaction of demand shown by Russian-Japanese war. But type 1, undoubtedly, has appeared before type 2 and took part in game since 1895. Type 2 is closer in manufacturing techniques (especially its sub-version 2.2) to type 3, rather than to type 1. Certainly I am very disturbed by absence of type with rivets carried on corners (personally I never met this type and never saw any photos). At 4 and 5 classes such type exists, and at 3 class it is not found (at least by myself). Why? Perhaps, we should search for the answer in number of golden kites conferred in 3 class? Maybe workshop which made 4 and 5 with the carried screws simply did not receive the order on 3 class because there was no demand (or it was completely satisfied by others workshops) And maybe after all such type (with the rivets carried on corners) exists. Lies somewhere and waits for me (or for you – greedy for Kites is a terrible thing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pieter1012 Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 Hi Japan X, according to the late Mr. Nakabori, a well known Japanese collector of orders & decorations, for the Japanese actions against the German possessions in China and the Pacific, 3000 Golden Kites were issued (Taisho 3-4 nen). For the participation of the Japanese in the Mediterranean and the dispatch of troops to Siberia 4800 Golden Kites were issued (Taisho 4-9 nen). Numbers of the higher classes of the Golden kite awarded during both periods first cl: 3, second cl: 5: third cl: 30, fourth cl: 200, fifth cl: 600. You omitted the Boxer rebellion (China 1900), according to Mr. Nakabori for this action 200 Golden Kites were awarded. Hope this little contribution helps you with your study on the types issued. Regards, Pieter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 26, 2011 Author Share Posted September 26, 2011 (edited) Hi Pieter and thank you very much! Very important information for me. Now it`s clear who was a mysterious "Japanese source". 30 kites in the third class and 800 in the fourth and fifth classes. It leave us with 6997 awards in two lower classes. Very unusual distribution of awards!!! And special thanks for number of awards for Boxer rebellion! Nick Edited September 26, 2011 by JapanX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 27, 2011 Author Share Posted September 27, 2011 Hi Pieter! If its not too much to ask - can you post number for 3,4,5,6 and 7 classes for Meiji and Taisho epochs. If you have them of course. Thanks Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 28, 2011 Author Share Posted September 28, 2011 In last post I mean Showa of course not Taisho... Sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pieter1012 Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Hi Nick, Mr. Nakabori mentions only the total numbers of Golden Kites awarded per war. to sum it up again; Japan-China war (1894-95); 2000 China 1900 (Boxer rebellion); 200 Russo-Japanese war (1904-05); 109600 1914-15 war (Tsingtao); 3000 1914-1920 war (Europe & Siberia); 4800 Tsinan Incident (1927-29); 70 Munchuraian Incident (1931-34); 9000 China Incident (1937- 40); 107000 He gives no figures for the Pacific war. The number of classes awarded I have from another Japanese collector, but he only has researched the figures for the 1st-5th class of the Golden Kite. Next to the numbers I gave you already for the Taisho period, he has for the Meiji periiod cummulatively; first cl 17, second cl 85, third cl 463, fourth cl 2250 and fifth cl 8400. For the Showa period he has only figures for the first and second class, 42 and 210 respectively, unfortunately no numbers on the lower grades. Pieter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 28, 2011 Author Share Posted September 28, 2011 Excellent! Very interesting and important information!!! :beer: Thank you again Pieter! "Meiji periiod cummulatively; first cl 17, second cl 85, third cl 463, fourth cl 2250 and fifth cl 8400. For the Showa period he has only figures for the first and second class, 42 and 210" This is really something! I knew only about meiji numbers for 1 class (yours numbers completely coincide with mine information). 42 and 210 for Showa period Are you sure that this is only Showa numbers? Maybe its a total number of all 1st and 2nd classes during Meiji-Taisho-Showa? Because according to my information total number for 1 classes is 42 (not 41 as Peterson stated in his book). Regards, Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pieter1012 Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Nick you are completely right, it should read 22 of the 1st cl and 120 of the 2d. The numbers I gave are the totals for the whole period. Also I made a spelling mistake, Munchuraian should ofcourse be Manchurian. Pieter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted September 29, 2011 Author Share Posted September 29, 2011 Nick you are completely right, it should read 22 of the 1st cl and 120 of the 2d. The numbers I gave are the totals for the whole period. Also I made a spelling mistake, Munchuraian should ofcourse be Manchurian. Pieter An again many thanks! Do you have any ideas how they got this numbers? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pieter1012 Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 Hi Nick, as I wrote earlier, I got them (already quite some time ago) from a longtime Japanese collector friend, who used to be a researcher at an university in Tokyo. I think he is retired now, although with Japanese you never know if they really retire. He had good contacts with researchers from the Government and Kunaicho archives. I think he assembled the figures by going through the Imperial resolutions. His main interest is certificates, especially those who have the signature of the Emperor. Pieter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted October 1, 2011 Author Share Posted October 1, 2011 Hi Peiter, I think that numbers are very accurate. Good job Mr. Nakabori!!!!! !!! I am planing to create a new topic completely devoted to golden kites statistics (including Pacific War period). Hope you will like it Regads, Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 Lately I found absolutely unknown (at least to me) type of 3rd class Golden Kite Order. Most likely it came from Taisho-early Showa epoch. Of course reverts have same position as all types that were shown in this thread. But the form of the kite is something absolutely new. According to the seller this kite was awarded to Army Captain Kikuchi... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanX Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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