Jump to content

Mythology of late Kites and Pillars

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 155
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

It was written about kites.

Probably about kites in all classes (sic!).

Another possibility – only about kites in 6th and 7th classes.

For a long time this sentence has been bothering me.


Because I’ve never seen such rough unpolished metal specimens.

Have you?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course it is quite natural to assume that when country doesn’t have enough aluminum to build plains it doesn’t have enough silver for the kites. And even more natural will be to assume, that when collapse of empire is round the corner practically everything become poor-quality. We can observe this process by way of example of late-war badges. Here we have an example of two merit badges of Japanese Naval Institute. On the left – classical high-quality piece and on the right late war specimen.

Link to post
Share on other sites

But this is badges.

And we are talking about the orders.

And not just orders, but about most prestigious order of them all – golden kite.

Does same story with poor-quality late pieces really happen here?

Whether really there are the kites executed in rough unpolished metal?

Let's try to sort this out.

Link to post
Share on other sites

We will begin with a unique source of the information on "poor-quality" kites.

I would like to attract attention of my colleagues to a word METAL.

Metal instead of habitual high-proof silver.

Simple metal which is

a) any of a number of chemical elements, such as iron or copper, that are often lustrous ductile solids, have basic oxides, form positive ions, and are good conductors of heat and electricity


b) an alloy, such as brass or steel, containing one or more of these elements

That’s why when I hear word “metal” (especially after multiplying this word by 70 years!) I expect to see something that maybe not completely “eaten away with rust”, but have some usual footprints of time (at least!). “Usual” for 70 years old metal pieces. Don’t you?

Link to post
Share on other sites

So this is all that we could extract from Peterson's phrase.

Whence he had obtained this information is not known.

I’ve personally never met poor made kites in metal.

But maybe it’s just me and my unlucky experience?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Despite of all aforesaid sometimes you can hear term "early-war kites" and "late-war kites" (war, of course, pacific one).

What’s is this?

On what ground one could place WW II kites into these categories?

Let’s look carefully into this issue.

Edited by JapanX
Link to post
Share on other sites

What it’s all about?

The main feature of alleged “early” kites is ideally polished reverse. The main feature of alleged “late” kites is sandblasted reverse (this is the main, but not one and only feature). Ok, let’s go visual. Here we have a nice gallery of “early” kites. 5th and 7th class.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Are these Peterson late WWII Kites?

Definitely NO!

These badges don’t look like they were made out of rough unpolished metal.

Do you really see rough metal dear colleagues?

The only thing I see is absence of polishing of silver reverse. Nothing more.

Quality of manufacturing of obverses is not lower – it’s exactly the same.

The same as quality of pieces with polished reverses.

Just take a look at this 5th class “late” kite.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok. I think it’s clear that these ones are not the awards that Peterson was taking about in his book. No way!

But do they “early” or “late”?

No way to tell for sure.

I think that polished/unpolished reverses can easily be a result of different batches, which can be manufactured simultaneously by different mint workshops.

Why not?

The only arbiter here could be 100% proof documented group with such kites in it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Any documented groups from late 30s and 1943-1945 period?

I never see any documented group on this time period (which is of course no proof that such group (or groups) doesn’t exists somewhere). Actually even if this group exists it can be accepted as sufficient prove that badges with unpolished reverses were made only during 1943-1945 time period. No records of their production exist to my knowledge. They could be as well as “early” kites as well as “late” kites or both.

Link to post
Share on other sites

“Manchukuo-made” “late” pillar pieces – do they really “late” and “Manchukuo-made”?

We find the same pattern (polished/sandblasted reverses) on the Manchukuo Pillars of the State orders (the gem of japanese phaleristics!).

Here is an example of two 3rd classes of pillars .

Edited by JapanX
Link to post
Share on other sites

But please note, that both specimens have very similar and high quality manufactured obverses.

And now the reverses of two “early” and “late” 4th (or, if you wish, 5th) classes.

Edited by JapanX
Link to post
Share on other sites

Striking differences! Often you could hear that badges with non-polished reverses are definitely from the late war period. Sometimes speaker even add that unpolished pillars are made by Manchukuo mint itself (I am not even aware that that there was Manchukuo mint!? I think that all orders and most badges were made by Japanese mint and only some badges were manufactured inside occupied China. The quality of manufacturing and technology itself are very very japanese).

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Blog Comments

    • Sounds great other than the Orange & Mango squash only because I prefer cran-pomegranate juice.
    • "(...) disgusting herbal concoction (...)" I took note of this description, to enrich my otherwise limited, English "Wortschatz"...
    • At work the standard indian tea such as PG tips is referred to as chimp tea. This goes back to the days when we had a Spanish girl working for us whose command of the English language was extremely limited. One lunch she said she was going to the shop could she get anything. I asked if she could get a pack of tea bags. She returned with some disgusting herbal concoction. I tried to explain what was required but without success. I then remembered PG tips had a picture of a chimpanzee on the packe
    • When I read Lapsang Souchong i decided to post something about these Tea . Many years ago I dont  know about Lapsang until I read James Michener book Centennial and the description of the savour of the Lapasang as a mix of tar and salt & smoked made me proof . It was exact ! and i liked it since then .
    • I have been known to drink Lapsang Souchong and Tea, Earl Grey, Hot... both "without pollutants". I normally have one mug of coffee in the morning, then spend the rest of the day drinking Orange & Mango squash (by the pint). Then evening comes and it's a pint, followed by red wine with dinner and sometimes a drop of Laphroaig afterwards.
  • Create New...