Gordon Craig Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Hi all, This medal just sold on ebay.com for just under $2000.00. It peked my interest and I wonder if anyone can tell me the name of the medal, or perhaps I should be calling it an order, and something about its history, how many grades it comes etc. Regards, Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted February 1, 2012 Author Share Posted February 1, 2012 The back of the medal/order is plain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ondras Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Gordon, this is not Czechoslovakian medal. This is an order of Slovakian independent state from years 1939 - 1945 called War Victory Cross. Maybe little bit of history. In 15. March 1939 Czech part of Czechoslovakia was taken by nazi Gemany and connected to the Third Reich as a protectorate Böhmen und Mähren. Day before, on 14 March 1939 indepentend Slovakian state was proclaimed in Slovak part of Czechoslovakia. This Slovakian state was ally of Germany and Slovakian army fought with Germans on Eastern front against Soviet union. After the Second World War was this two parts again connected to Czechoslovakia. So, your example is War Victory Cross 2 nd class. During its history regulations was several times changed. At the start of issuing, there was three classes, from year 1943 there was eight classes ( Grand cross and seven normal classes ) of this order. It was military order and which class would be given depended on rank of the awarded soldier. I could be given to the foreign soldier too. To soldiers from Axis alliance. This is only simplified version of system of ordering, it was little bit complicated, with many changes during time. So this is rare order and mainly in Slovakia are these order from Second world war time wery popular and prized. Here are photos of this order with rare original box from the internet. and the second floor of the box with miniatures. Regards Ondrej Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 Ondrej, Thanks for the response. I thought perhaps this was from the Slovak State but since the name of the area changes so often its difficult to know what to call something. Perhaps as I get more knowledgable about Czech/Czechoslovakia/Slovakia etc I'll know what term to use. Because of thsi problem, it is common for English speaking collectors to refer to everythng from this area as "Czech". Whether this is right or wrong is not really important to the collector. Just a commonly done thing. Thanks agaon for the information on this award. It looks very interesting and when I can find time I'll try to do more research on it. Regards, Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marrauder Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Gordon, it is very easy. Term Czechoslovakia means Czech republic and Slovak republic together, in Federation (1918-1939 and 1945 - 1992). Before those dates both states were in Austrian monarchy for nearly 1.000 years. After 1992 they are quasi independent states, that in fact obey the rules of European Union. That period 1939 - 1945 is very important to differ between Czech republic that became Bohmen und Mahren protectorat and Slovak republic, that became (again quasi) independent state. Militaria of Slovak state (39-45) are very rare and priced, because Slovakia had only two divisions on Eastern front. Slovaks are typical "morale soldiers". When Germany was winning, they were fighting very bravely (Slovaks, together with LSSAH seized Rostov na Donu, Slovak pilots flew in JG52 together with Hartmann), but when war fortune changed sides, they were mass deserting. Czechs are typical "nichtkämpfers". I call them slavic Italians, hehe. Last time they fought during 30 years war, and their "promo" at Biela Hora, 1620 was disaster. During ww2 they were working for the Reich, enjoying bismarckian social system (with rents and retirement) implanted there by Reinhard Heydrich. His assasination (prepared by London, not by Czech resistance which in fact didn´t exist) is well known, less known is the fact that there was spontaneous mourning demonstration for Heydrich´s support, that 30.000 people attended. First and very funny Czech "Uprising" started already at 5th of May 1945, when Hitler was already dead for a week. Another interesting details: 1. Slovakia is the first and only German ally to begin the war already in september 1939 against Poland. 2. It is less known fact, that war movement in fact started in Slovakia, in 26th August 1939, when division Brandenburg received the "halt ordnung" very late and was already engaging in Jablunkovsky Pass. 3. There are three Knight´s crosses awarded to Slovaks. First two were given to commanders of Slovak Army (gen. Malar and gen. Turanec), third one to the Slovak volunteer in waffen SS, Gustáv Wendrinský from SS Florian Geyer Division. With 41 confirmed tank kills, Wendrinský was the best anti tank gunner of ww2 (called "cruel dog from Pressburg"). He died during breakthrough attempt from Budapest encirclement. 4. One of the recipients of the Slovak War Victory Cross was also infamous Oskar Dirlewanger. I am posting photo with Slovak award on the neck, under the Knights Cross. Regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtender Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 The order on Ebay was replica, not original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted February 10, 2012 Author Share Posted February 10, 2012 The order on Ebay was replica, not original. Xtender, That is very interesting information. Someone over payed then. I'll have to do some research and see if I can tell the originals from the fakes. Regards, Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ondras Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Before those dates both states were in Austrian monarchy for nearly 1.000 years. Yes, man you know a lot about the history. With no regards, Ondrej Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marrauder Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Finally you´ve found one info which is not clearly defined, and created opinion that it means all other my info is trash. But in fact, this was the only moment in my long essay, that you could slightly doubt. We were talking about 20th century history, so I shortened the long and complicated history of two different states in the (for now) irrelevant medieval past to the diplomatic term nearly. I know, for Slovakia it is totally and for Czech lands less than half of it, but in this case it doesn´t matter if you want to explain basic differences of 20th century history to the foreigner. Look, before you start with your "no regards", it would be good to know, that 90% of my info about Czechs is from czech sources. I am enjoying mainly Martin Krystlík, and his Zamlčené dějiny I., II. (Hidden History). He belongs to the few authors that are not happy with funny heroical legends and damages the official myths - myths about Munich 38, about protectorate, about expelling the Germans, etc. Regards gentleman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted December 18, 2014 Author Share Posted December 18, 2014 (edited) The order on Ebay was replica, not original. What do you think of this one? And what makes you say the one I posted originally was a fake? I understand that originals should be marked with the silver content and the statement mark. Where should these two marks be located on the back of the award? Regards, Gordon Edited December 18, 2014 by Gordon Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kolorado Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 Dear Gordon. I have one question. On your last photo of the Order have the marked.brands It is the original? Regards , Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utopis Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 What do you think of this one? And what makes you say the one I posted originally was a fake? I understand that originals should be marked with the silver content and the statement mark. Where should these two marks be located on the back of the award? Regards, Gordon Must have overlooked this topic. Anyways - is this your piece? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted January 1, 2015 Author Share Posted January 1, 2015 utopis, No this is not my piece. I was trying to buy it and asked my question because I was unsure as to where the markings should be on the medal. I had read that the two markings on these pieces were supposed to be on the base of the eagle as shown in one picture below. What I was trying to do with the vendor was find out what the marks were on the back of the medal on the two projections at the top. Also shown in a picture below. I was unable to get good pictures of the markings on the back of the medal before the vendor sold it to someone else. Do you know what the markings on the back of the medal are? Regards, Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kolorado Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 http://www.medal-medaille.com/sold/product_info.php?cPath=89&products_id=2092 with maker's mark 'K' and '987' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted January 1, 2015 Author Share Posted January 1, 2015 koloado, Thanks. I was aware of the marks on the eagle. The marks on the back of the actual medal was what I was referring to. They also appear to be K for the maker and the other mark for the silver content. Regards, Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Craig Posted December 5, 2020 Author Share Posted December 5, 2020 Gentlemen, I would like to bring my thread back to life again with some new questions. Now that I think we are reasonably certain as to the correct markings on the War Victory Cross that came with a ribbon lets move on the Order with a chain suspension. Does anyone know if the Order with the chain was made by the state mint or was it made by a private firm. Here are some pictures of one with a chain suspension with different markings than the one with the ribbon suspension. Really interested in your comments thoughts. Regards, Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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