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Belgian Victory Medals


Guest Darrell
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Nice piece! Could yo place a picture of the reverse, so see the finishing?

GM1

Thanks GM1, we're on vacation in Austria right now, but I'll post a picture of the reverse after we get home on Sunday.

On a separate note, I went into a military antiques store in Vienna and was very lucky in that I found the Lejsek and Riemer versions. I mentioned in another thread that I had been looking for those rather obsessively, so I was pleasantly surprised to find them in Austria, of all places. Anyone have an opinion as to why two hard-to-find Czech-made Belgian medals would be in Vienna? They had some other fairly common vics (Italian, French, Japanese, and British), but I was surprised to find these in particular.

Apologies for the awkward angle of the pictures, but we're on a train right now, so my maneuverability is limited.

Lejsek:

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2013/post-16545-0-80224300-1388160079.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2013/post-16545-0-81125200-1388160095.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2013/post-16545-0-75424500-1388160115.jpg

Riemer:

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2013/post-16545-0-02186400-1388160168.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2013/post-16545-0-30265100-1388160183.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2013/post-16545-0-07575200-1388160196.jpg

Edited by davidckahn
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Hello David,

Thanks GM1, we're on vacation in Austria right now, but I'll post a picture of the reverse after we get home on Sunday.

On a separate note, I went into a military antiques store in Vienna and was very lucky in that I found the Lejsek and Riemer versions. I mentioned in another thread that I had been looking for those rather obsessively, so I was pleasantly surprised to find them in Austria, of all places. Anyone have an opinion as to why two hard-to-find Czech-made Belgian medals would be in Vienna? They had some other fairly common vics (Italian, French, Japanese, and British), but I was surprised to find these in particular.

Lejsek:

Riemer:

A nice pair of a Leisek and a Riemer produced Belgian model vic. Of note is the Leisek is the unofficial type 1a variety with the 'LA' mark only on the reverse.

The unofficial type 1 Leisek variety is a bit more difficult to obtain and it has the 'LA' mark on both the obverse and reverse.

Once you get started down this road there just seems to be so many varieties to collect.

Regards,
Rob

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My medal above came with a mini...about 12mm diameter; ribbon is 35mm long (doubled).

And this little "wire" loop in the ribbon colors; it is about 18mm long and 2-3mm wide.

Also have a similar "wire" loop in the colors of the Commemorative Medal of the War 1914-1918.

Edited by IrishGunner
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Hello IrishGunner,

My medal above came with a mini...about 12mm diameter; ribbon is 35mm long (doubled).

And this little "wire" loop in the ribbon colors; it is about 18mm long and 2-3mm wide.

Also have a similar "wire" loop in the colors of the Commemorative Medal of the War 1914-1918.

The 'wire loop' is a designed for fitting on the lapel of a jacket. It is a commonly seen accoutrement especially with french and belgian items.

Regards,
Rob

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Here are my Belgian vics. Still puzzled as to why the Riemer and Lejsek versions were at a store in Vienna, but I'm not complaining

Left to right: official, Lejsek, Riemer, uniface:

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_01_2014/post-16545-0-59562000-1388847391.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_01_2014/post-16545-0-81138700-1388847408.jpg

Edited by davidckahn
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  • 1 month later...

I received a Belgian official in the mail a few days ago, because, despite its poor condition, it was cheap and I wanted the silver bars, When it arrived, I found the planchet to be noticeably thicker than my other Belgian official example. There are no makers marks or the word "BRONZE" along the edge, so it's a regular Type 1, as far as I can tell. Anyone have an opinion on the differing thickness?

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Hello David,

I received a Belgian official in the mail a few days ago, because, despite its poor condition, it was cheap and I wanted the silver bars, When it arrived, I found the planchet to be noticeably thicker than my other Belgian official example. There are no makers marks or the word "BRONZE" along the edge, so it's a regular Type 1, as far as I can tell. Anyone have an opinion on the differing thickness?

Not all French produced Belgian vics were marked on the rim with either the maker stamp or the word BRONZE. Some have no markings at all and have a thicker planchet with file like striations.

A combined pic of the obverse/reverse, showing your thicker planchet example, alongside the thinner example may be of assistance. This way there might be a few more clues, in particular the size of the ball suspender.

Regards,
Rob

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi Gents,

I recently acquired what appears to be a Belgian Official Type 1, but it has a couple of odd features:

belgoddity01-crop_zpsbcddadb3.jpg

Obverse ...

belgoddity02-crop_zps22daa356.jpg

... and reverse.

And the close-ups:

belgoddity01-crop02_zps126d7aa5.jpg

Obverse ...

belgoddity02-crop-02_zpse6f2eae2.jpg

... and reverse.

The name Paul Dubois appears on the obverse, but the reverse is off-set by about 10 degrees right. The ball suspension is rather crudely soldered to the planchet, and the planchet seems to have been coated in gold lacquer - it's worn off on the high spots, particularly on the reverse. The ball is not coated, and seems to be bronze.

Dimensions seem to match the other example I have - 32mm diameter and 2.4mm thickness. The ribbon seems to be original Belgian, and there are two holes at the end which fit the two-pronged mounting device. There are no marks on the edge.

So, is it the real deal, or a copy? If a copy, is it contemporary with the real thing, or a cheap and nasty modern creation designed to deceive the gullible?

Any comments welcome.

Bill

Edited by Bilco
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Hi Bill, it certainly looks real to me. I would guess that the suspension broke and was later resoldered and that someone intentionally gilded it. I have a French official that was silvered by the owner, so I wouldn't be surpriset to hear that some are also gilded. I can't imagine why anyone would fake a Belgian Type 1, as they are so common...not much profit to be had from producing such a fake.

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Hello Bill,

Hi Gents,

I recently acquired what appears to be a Belgian Official Type 1, but it has a couple of odd features:

The name Paul Dubois appears on the obverse, but the reverse is off-set by about 10 degrees right. The ball suspension is rather crudely soldered to the planchet, and the planchet seems to have been coated in gold lacquer - it's worn off on the high spots, particularly on the reverse. The ball is not coated, and seems to be bronze.

Bill

I would echo david's thoughts in that the medal itself looks fine although most likely repaired. The ball suspender does appear to be a bit larger than that normally seen and the registration shift in the reverse design is certainly interesting. I have seen other Belgian vics that have off-centre obverse-reverse dies so that can be explained.

I have also seen vics either silvered or with a gilt finish so that in itself is not unknown.

A nice example nonetheless.

Regards,
Rob

Edited by RobW
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Hi Gents,

Many thanks for the positive response. I've been looking at my other Belgian Official and Unofficial types, and I find that I have an Unofficial Type 2 which also has the off-set right reverse ...

2belgs03-crop_zps20ad4354.jpg

Obverses, Official on left ...

2belgs01-crop_zps78ff7a77.jpg

... and reverses. The Unofficial Type 2 also has traces of gilding.

Bill

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Hello,

Hello Bill,

I have seen other Belgian vics that have off-centre obverse-reverse dies so that can be explained.

I have also seen vics either silvered or with a gilt finish so that in itself is not unknown.

A nice example nonetheless.

Regards,
Rob

Here is a model with a bail shifted.
I take this opportunity to introduce you to a reduction in silver.
Regards
Jean-Michel

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Hi Jean-Michel,

Many thanks for the photos. Is the reverse of the medal with the suspension shifted to the left aligned with the obverse, or is the ball aligned correctly with the reverse?

Bill

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  • 2 months later...

Another recent acquisition: Belgian type 1A

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_06_2014/post-16545-0-42878900-1403027179.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_06_2014/post-16545-0-04886700-1403027258.jpg

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  • 4 weeks later...

I recently acquired a Riemer unofficial version and, since I now have two of them, I thought I'd offer it for trade. Would anyone be interested in trading for one of the following: Great Britain Type 1, Greece Type 3, Italy Type 5, Romania Type 3 or 3A, South Africa Type 1.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hello David,

I recently acquired a Riemer unofficial version and, since I now have two of them, I thought I'd offer it for trade. Would anyone be interested in trading for one of the following: Great Britain Type 1, Greece Type 3, Italy Type 5, Romania Type 3 or 3A, South Africa Type 1.

You have certainly requested some interesting items in trade. For your awareness; the Great Britain type 1, Greece type 3, Italy type 5, and Romanian type 3A are probably some of the rarest of the series to find. They are seen rarely and few have them in their collections. I wish you good luck in your trading endeavours.

Regards,

Rob

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Hello David,

Further to my last post there are some significant differences between the South African type 1 and type 2 varieties. More details, including pictures, can be found in posts #2 & #3 on the South African sub-thread of this forum.

Regards,

Rob

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The only one of these I haven't seen at least once is the Greek unofficial type 2. I missed out on the other three when I saw them, but am holding out hope that someone will have an extra for trade, since the Riemer Belgian is also quite rare.

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