Weight Redused on Belts (Koppel?)

[Jurgen Fritz]

Hi  Gents: I weighed two  German Belts 50mm (2") ~ 30 gram

 

                                                                 45mm        ~ 27 gram

I cannot imagine that  ~ 3- 4 Gram makes a weight Difference for the Wearer?

after WW  2 the Bundeswehr brought back 50 mm Belts? even with heavier Brassbuckle? (Koppel) even left the

Tonge & Tab later in 2WW ! (To safe Leather? Any INFO very apreciated Yours

Jurgen

 

 

Edited January 16, 2022 by Jurgen Fritz
added text & Photos

[Gordon Craig]

Jurgen,

 

Since your question relates to the Bundeswehr I suggest that you post you question in the Post War BRD and DDR sub forum.

 

Regards,

Gordon

 

[Jurgen Fritz]

Gorden Craig well the Topic isn about BW

all Geman Belts! (Koppel)

 

[Bayern]

Jurgen Fritz, German Koppeln in the XX Century varied enormously in quality and duration according to the type of leather available to manufacture it . when a raw hide is tanned the final product is at least of three categories acording if comes from the back of the animal ,the flanks or the limbs , that determines the thickness and endurance , apart, usually the tanned piece is cut in two portions the upper the best one the lower the second class . Germany suffered during WW1 shortages of good quality leather , and again in WW2 then, lower quality leather was employed . another consideration is the cost , the DDR NVA employed a mid quality leather for their Koppeln , inclusive thats of the officers . 

[v.Perlet]

Hello Jurgen Fritz,

 

the whole belt thing is called Koppel, the belt buckle is the Koppelschloss.

What Bayern wrote is absolutely correct. (30)g, indicates that you are referring to the Koppelschloss.

Due to the economical issues during the war, the Koppelschloss itself even if it was meant for an e.g. 50mm belt was also worn at many times with a 45 mm belt. The difference of weight regarding the reduced Koppelschloss dimensions is therefore not just due to a reduced size of the belt, but also due to an e.g. 50mm Koppelschlosses change in material.

E.g. from solid brass to a stamped steel zinc coated Koppelschloss.

see: https://ir63.org/koppel.html

Regards

v.Perlet

[Bayern]

v Perlet , thanks for your intervention ! I must add that due to shortages of metal some Koppelschlosse were made of Magnesium ,very light

[v.Perlet]

Hello Bayern,

 

yes magnesium metal too, even though it has a tendency to tarnish, but it is lighter then aluminum, very resistant to corrosion and easy machinable - actually perfect ?
 

Regards

v.Perlet

[Jurgen Fritz]

Thanks for the INFO My Friends!

My Question was more WHY the actual Leather  50mm Koppel Belts were reduced to 45mm?  (NOT The Buckles)..Some say it was to save some gramms on weighting Equipment..cannot believe that! about 30 gramms! I weighed!..  OK here some Bakelite Buckles rare Volkssturm?.Thanks & Regards Jurgen

Edited January 31, 2022 by Jurgen Fritz
added Bekelite Koppel schloss Belt Buckle

[v.Perlet]

Hello Jurgen Fritz;

 

it's actually the other way around, that is why I pointed the Koppel issue towards the Koppelschloss.

50mm was only a standard till 1895 in e.g. the Bavarian army. From then on in order to reduce weight on the filed gear the buckle was reduced to 45mm. Initially the buckles were made of brass (very heavy) and from 1914 buckles were made of steel and later as already described in lighter alloys - due to the overall economic situation in Germany.

Since belt-buckles were reduced to 45mm - naturally the belt was adjusted/reduced to 45mm as well and as far as I know also by eliminating the overlapping length of belts - meaning the belts were also shortened.

 

What many people underestimate or totally forget is that Germany due to an highly efficient naval blockade was entirely cut of from any essential import of goods right down to food or nutrition items from 1915 onward. Hunger and even starvation was far more serious in WW1 then in WW2.

 

So any item was reduced in size and weight - including food rations.

 

In regards to your reference towards the Bundeswehr, you need to keep in mind that this Koppel is only worn on the Parade-dress or official commemorative occasions including the wearing of a steel-helmet - it is not allowed to be worn on the Ausgehanzug used for non-combat associated tasks and is certainly not part of the combat fatigue dress.

 

I happened to have served in a Bundeswehr unit - who's WW2 veteran commander obtained the special permission in the late 70's to wear this Koppel with the Ausgehanzug during Guard-duty. The day he left the unit in the early 80's, the Koppel left with him. AFAIK the only unit in the Bundeswehr to do so. And we hated to wear it, because it was heavy and uncomfortable (you couldn't really bend/move around with your body without being hindered by the Koppel) The 70's/80's Koppelschloss and IIRC the belt was far more heavier then the version from the 90's onward.

 

As for issues related to Adolf - I am totally not in that league, or posses any knowledge towards collectables of that period, - sorry can't help you on that one.

 

Regards

v.Perlet

Edited February 1, 2022 by v.Perlet

[Jurgen Fritz]

Hello Thanks v.Perlet

Yep as it happend I weighed both old 1870  50 mm Prussian Koppel with Buckle & the IIWW 45 mm broad Koppel with Steelbuckle - the Difference was only 30 gramm! not much less Weight the?

in my BW Time (4 Years Volonteer) we wore the new 1963 Leather Belt  also for Guard Dury to the Service Uniform. I found it not unconfortable to wear with the Pistol..We were allowed to wear Private purchased Leather Belts with the "All Day" Work Uniform.

Indeed most II WK Koppel found are very short lucky You found one over 100cm lenght! ..that maybe due that the Soldiers were very Young..or undernutured?

Best Regards Juergen

Edited February 3, 2022 by Jurgen Fritz
addition Text