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Let's backtrack for a moment to the Rumanian VIC.

Understanding the Laslo reference is now somewhat dated, with more information coming to light since his last revision in 1992 and more items being seen these days on the market; what do you think of this piece?

It was listed as an original with the designer's name "Kristesko" on the reverse. However, there are noticeable die differences between the official Type 1 that Laslo describes in his book and this one. Is this another modern example with the name added, or is it an authentic version Laslo did not cover?

Tim

Hello Tim,

This Romanian vic looks okay to me. Other than the fact that it is suspended from Italian victory medal ribbon, it just appears to be more worn in some areas than the examples I posted. I would suggest that the differences are as a result of some rubbing and wear on the face and obverse.

The 'Kristesko' signature on the reverse looks good to me as well, just slightly more worn. The rings and font used on the country names is consistent with an official issue.

In addition to those areas of wear that you have listed there is also a large amount of wear on the reverse of the ball suspender, indicating much rubbing and contact over a period of time.

When I have time I will re-scan one of my official Rom vics in larger detail so that others can compare.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Rob

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Thanks Rob!

Yes, sometimes the scans are just too fuzzy to make out the finer details. I had thought it might be an original Type 1 and almost went for it, but in the end, I opted to find a better conditioned one that leaves no doubts.

So, to the best of your knowledge, are there copies out there with the "Kristesko" stamp?

Much appreciated,beer.gif

Tim

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So, to the best of your knowledge, are there copies out there with the "Kristesko" stamp?

Much appreciated,

Tim

Hello Tim,

In regards a copy with the 'Kristesko' stamp; yes there is definitely such a type.

I will be a bit vague lest I contribute to the education of the fakers that may be out there. Specifically; the 'Kristesko' mark is in raised relief instead of the letters being incused as on the official vic.

It is most often seen on some of the online auction sites and is euphemistically sold as an official piece or even as a 'modern repro'.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Rob

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When I have time I will re-scan one of my official Rom vics in larger detail so that others can compare.

Here is another close-up of the official Rom vic.

Obverse.

Regards,

Rob

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3. Romania

Hello Noor,

Thanks for the very useful and handy updates to ribbon bars on thread. The vic medals are one thing but the actual ribbon bars always speak to the collector as well.

Regards,

Rob

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Hello Tim,

In regards a copy with the 'Kristesko' stamp; yes there is definitely such a type.

I will be a bit vague lest I contribute to the education of the fakers that may be out there. Specifically; the 'Kristesko' mark is in raised relief instead of the letters being incused as on the official vic.

It is most often seen on some of the online auction sites and is euphemistically sold as an official piece or even as a 'modern repro'.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Rob

Hello Tim

I did this in a black and white to help you see it a littler clearer. And I agree with all the Rob just posted on the Romanian Vic.

Johnmymac (JM)

Edited by johnnymac
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Hi guys!

Thanks for the close-ups Rob, that will help as there is only one die to really compare originals to.

JM, that is a good reference to have!!

The problem of poor seller's PIC's will still be the remaining issue here but, I now have a little more to use for comparisons. Again, many thanks!!beer.gif

Tim

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Hi guys!

Thanks for the close-ups Rob, that will help as there is only one die to really compare originals to.

JM, that is a good reference to have!!

The problem of poor seller's PIC's will still be the remaining issue here but, I now have a little more to use for comparisons. Again, many thanks!!beer.gif

Tim

Hello Tim,

I would wholeheartedly agree that having good quality close-up pictures of the obverse and reverse of the official strikes is very handy. It aids in identifying the official pieces against the myriad of unofficial and subsequent reproduction pieces.

I am hopeful that other vic collectors will also post good close-ups of their pieces for the rest of the collecting fraternity to view and use and to compare.

In specific reference to the Rom vic there are a few strikes that were produced by different French manufacturers that closely resemble the official strike so it does pay to have a confirmed official close up pic to compare.

Regards,

Rob

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Hi Rob,

That is what I thought might be the case on the one I posted questions on above. I still think there are slight differences on that one from the original that you show.

The problem with the Rumanian VIC's, are so many unofficial ones are out there in original groups due to the problems/limitations with the official mint back then.

Tim

This one was listed recently; nice group!!

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With regards the Romanian Victory Medal, KRISTESKO the designer was an emigre Romanian living and working in France, this might have something to do with a contract being awarded to the French for the supply of the official Romanian victory medal, as the French were busy making their own medals, as well as a couple or more other countries.

King Ferdinand I authorised by official decree a copy following the design of the official one to be made and worn by those entitled to receive the medal for service in WW1.

There is a great deal of photographic evidence to support the point that many officers and men never bothered to exchange the unofficial for the official, particularly amongst large officers bars when fully mounted together.

While Mr. Laslo identifies up to Type 3a types in the category section on Romania its evident that there are many variations amongst them, due to local manufacture in Romania, with struck, cast, materials, ribbon ring mounting, small variation in diameter, thickness, weight etc..etc..

Kevin in Deva :beer:

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi Rob,

That is what I thought might be the case on the one I posted questions on above. I still think there are slight differences on that one from the original that you show.

The problem with the Rumanian VIC's, are so many unofficial ones are out there in original groups due to the problems/limitations with the official mint back then.

Tim

This one was listed recently; nice group!!

Hello Tim,

Last posts for a while.

I would agree that there are always differences in the medals seen on bars. In the case of the full-size bar the victory medal depicted is, in Mr Laslo's parlance, an unofficial type 2; Reverse N variety.

I would also agree that it is a nice full size group.

Regards,

Rob

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This one was listed recently; nice group!!

Tim,

The miniature group is also nice and shows a good spread of awards as follows:

1. Order of the Crown

2. Twenty Five Years Service decoration

3. Trans Danube Cross, 1877-78

4. Balkan Wars medal 1913

5. Commemorative War Cross 1916-18

6. Victory medal

7. Peles Medal 1933

8. Carol I Centennial Medal 1839-1939

Of note is that the vic is 14mm in diameter indicating local Romanian manufacture. French mini's came in generally standard sizes of 10, 11, 13 and 15mm.

Regards,

Rob

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I'll add a couple here to keep it going for a day or two.

Here's my first Romanian VIC; finally.2014.gif Ribbon is shot unfortunately but, the medal is in decent condition and an official version with the designer's name on the reverse.

Tim

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I'll add a couple here to keep it going for a day or two.

Here's my first Romanian VIC; finally.2014.gif Ribbon is shot unfortunately but, the medal is in decent condition and an official version with the designer's name on the reverse.

Tim

Hello Tim,

This particular French produced ribbon indeed frayes and crumbles particularly easy. It is also seen on the official Greek victory medal that have survived with their boxes of issue.

Regards,

Rob

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  • 9 months later...

The Rumanian VM is own is an identified piece.

It belonged to Captain Robert Gardescu. It is an official type 1, complete with hook and eye at the backside.

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  • 9 months later...

I think it would a nice purchase for $100 - $150. but no more than that. But if I wanted a Unofficial type 3 and believed that I might not find one in better condition then this one, then maybe $210 is the right price. I can not spend from your wallet for you. I have my own rules: (1) if I want it, I will buy it and I will take a small lose and will sell it when I find a better example. (2) If I think I will second agree myself as to should I have brought the item then I will just walk away from the item.

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Hallo lambert, :D

It looks o.k. to me, the price @ 160 Euro seems reasonable as well,

regardless of the type, and its got a period ribbon.

Kevin in Deva. :D

Edited by Kev in Deva
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Hi Jim

I'm the type that follows the rule 2. :D

There is a great opportunity to purchase this item.

:)

I take into consideration that the Medal pleases me.

is ... possible.

Lambert

Edited by lambert
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HI Gents,

My latest acquisition - the Romanian Official type.

Obverse:

romania03.jpg

Reverse:

romania04.jpg

Close-ups:

romania03-crop.jpg

romania04-crop.jpg

And the Kristesko incised name:

romania04-kristesku.jpg

The ribbon seems to be new - it's very smooth and stiff - and it's a type I haven't seen before. Can anyone say which country it is?

Any comments welcome.

Bill

Edited by Bilco
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