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As a "silver" Romanian Victory medal, to my mind, its not an outright fake, but a private purchase / commissioned vanity item, I have seen an examples of The Romanian Cross of War being in gilt for Romanian Officers, where as the other ranks are invairaibly in a bronze color.

I have also seen a green enameled Romanian Cross of War amongst the collection on exhibition in Timisoara, this too was privately commissioned by the original owner.

To all,

While a little of topic, and to further reinforce Kevin's point, here is a picture of what appears to be a silvered Romanian War Cross. While this item is from a current ebay auction it does at least appear to be of silvered appearance and finish.

It just goes to show that there are always going to exceptions to the rule.

Regards,

Rob

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I think we all came to the consensus or almost :unsure::D ... If the price was more affordable (much) I would not mind acquiring there .. patience ..

Lambert

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Rob to answer your question on the silver Romanian War Cross Was is it "exception to the rule". I do have to ask, was that R.W.M. medal made for a veteran? Or for a growing collector's market who can't get the real medal?

The same would apply here, were either of these two silver U.S. vic's made for veterans? or for a growing collector's market? Or were they made as and implied to be a rare and new medal. I'll stand by what I feel is a proper term for my two silver medals, fakes until there is a firm answer to why they excite. In collecting I use the highway road sign "STOP" look both way before proceeding.

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With regards Silvered Inter-Allied Victory medals I again refer to the bottom of page 8 in "The Inter-Allied Victory Medals of World War 1, II Edition, by Alexander J. Laslo.

(4) A specimen of the British, Unofficial Type 3 Rumanian, and U.S. Victory Medal with a silver finish has been noted. Since the silver finish appears to have been added to beautify the receipiant's

medal after its issue or purchase, such specimens have not been categorized as a basic type.

Other examples with the added silver finish probably exsist throughout the Victory Medal series.

By the way at the Collectors Fair in Brasov, Central Romania, in amongst 150 tables of items, yesterday 01 September 2012 only 3 examples of the Romanian Inter-Allied Victory medals were observed by me, 1 Official with bronze finish and two Unofficial type 3's with gilt finish.

There is no evidence, whatsoever in Romania, that silver Romanian Royal period medals of any type are currantly being produced for Collectors outside the country, the original items such as the Romanian Cross of War (both types) 1916 - 1918 and 1916 - 1919 are readly available on places like Ebay, and Ebay France. (Its far harder to get the accompnying battle bars) There is evidence of vanity pieces being commissioned by Romanian military offices and military officer veterans in Romanian collections and museums.

Kevin in Deva.

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Then we must try to verify is it exactly the same size as the Un-official Type 3, made from the same die and silvered, is it a silver-plated Un-official Type 3 or is it a cast copy in silver?

Kevin in Deva.

Hello Kevin,

A closer look at the pics provided from the ebay listing shows what appears to be a test cut on the right front of the obverse on the rim. While it cannot be conclusively determined it does appear that the material underneath is of a silver finish. This suggests an item that is silver. If it were of a silvered-bronze material the bronze would be visible underneath.

I would suggest that the item is more likely to be a cast copy in silver.

Regards,

Rob

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I think we all came to the consensus or almost :unsure::D ... If the price was more affordable (much) I would not mind acquiring there .. patience ..

Lambert

Hello Lambert,

The Romanian vics, both the official stike as well as the myriad of unofficial varieties are seen irregularly in the market. While they are appearing more often in the online auction houses the prices continue their upward spiral and are becoming a bit more difficult to obtain.

If opportunity presents I would try to obtain the official strike first before any of the unofficial varieties.

The same can be said for the award certificates. They are seen on an infrequent basis and always seem to attract a premium price.

Regards,

Rob

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With regards Silvered Inter-Allied Victory medals I again refer to the bottom of page 8 in "The Inter-Allied Victory Medals of World War 1, II Edition, by Alexander J. Laslo.

Quote

(4) A specimen of the British, Unofficial Type 3 Rumanian, and U.S. Victory Medal with a silver finish has been noted. Since the silver finish appears to have been added to beautify the receipiant's

medal after its issue or purchase, such specimens have not been categorized as a basic type.

Other examples with the added silver finish probably exsist throughout the Victory Medal series.

Kevin in Deva.

Hello Kevin,

In line with your comments I have also seen a silvered bronze variety of the official Romanian victory medal. Again this is likely to have been done to enhance the finish of the recipients medal.

Regards,

Rob

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Hello Lambert,

The Romanian vics, both the official stike as well as the myriad of unofficial varieties are seen irregularly in the market. While they are appearing more often in the online auction houses the prices continue their upward spiral and are becoming a bit more difficult to obtain.

If opportunity presents I would try to obtain the official strike first before any of the unofficial varieties.

The same can be said for the award certificates. They are seen on an infrequent basis and always seem to attract a premium price.

Regards,

Rob

Hello Rob,

I agree, I have always sought opportunities to get an official type 1 with affordable price.

I have also noticed that there is a certain frequency to Vic Czech, official and unofficial, and decreased Vic Greek type 1.

Interestingly, at least one time every two months appears a Cuban Vic.

Lambert

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Hello Rob,

I agree, I have always sought opportunities to get an official type 1 with affordable price.

Lambert

Hello Lambert,

Have fun with your search for an official type. I have recently obtained a document group of 4 to the same gentleman. Definitely not as easy as finding the medals in the first place, but still worth the search. :)

Regards,

Rob

Edited by RobW

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Hi Gents,

Another oddity, trawled up from the Internet. I thought my eyes were going funny at first -

Romaniaoddunoffical03.jpg

- but it looks like the names of the countries have been double-struck, with a little movement between strikes. The movement is worse at the upper part of the reverse. The underlying design is crisp and clear - were the names normally struck after the rest of the design?

Bill

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Hello Bill,

An interesting over-strike error. I have seen a few of these on the Romanian vics. While it is possible that the country names were struck after the main die that would be speculative at best. Without access to the original die we are not likely to know. It is also possible that the planchet moved during the stiking process.

Either way it is an interesting die strike error. Certainly plays tricks on the eyes.

Regards,

Rob

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Rear.

Kevin in Deva.

Hello Kevin,

A nice looking medal in good condition.

I note that the ribbon on this Romanian vic appears to be of recent production generally seen in the UK. Is that the case? Is the ribbon clipping and attachment on the back done locally?

Regards,

Rob

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Hi Rob, :D

unfortunately that little beauty is not mine, :( the cropped pictures above, are from a very large resolution colour scan that was printed and sent to me by a fellow collector in the U.K.

The medal and ribbon shown are an original period piece, as issued by the Romanian's.

I have a 7cm piece of the same ribbon in my collection here in Deva, and its similar to the "watered silk" weave found on original items, smooth / soft to the touch and not like the modern reproduction ribbons.

The style of clipping is Romanian, I am of the opinion, this peace was fashioned in a very proffesional manner, and was typical for the official Romanian issued pieces, other styles of Romanian ribbon folds and cliping being the trade mark of unofficial issue / home production, where an official medal sports a diffent ribbon its very likely it was a replacement piece or added when Romanian Victory medals were proffessionaly mounted into bars, particularly those in mounted Officer groups.

Kevin in Deva.

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Another Printed Scan:-

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_09_2012/post-950-0-43866300-1348136419.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_09_2012/post-950-0-60826800-1348136467.jpg

Kevin in Deva

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