Gordon Williamson

What the ?????????

Phil,

Michel is absolutely correct. Frank & Reif did not make these badges. I believe all the original known badges from this firm (Army) are mid / late war zinkers with the makers name in relief, so that the name was reverse stamped into the die face.

I don't think this firm (which described itself as "metal stampers" as opposed to award manufacturers, only came into the badge market in the second half of the war. I don't believe they were making Tombak naval badges like this in the first half of the war.

The badge is a fairly close copy of the Schwerin type and can also be found unmarked. The unmarked ones fooled a lot of people when they first appeared and were passed off as unmarked Schwerins.

Hi Gordon,

Can you confirm that Frank and Reif did NOT make U boat badges, I have seen a few recently at fairs being sold as original and I must say the the quality is excellent.

Thanks,

Phil

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Not correct, this is a touched up picture or drawing...the flowers look like what is found on a sc Porsche badge, there is no known eagle head of? his design-it seems a composite of many PAB designs- S&L being such large producer of PAB's-Not one major collecter has a badge as pictured--you show me this badge for real and I'll show you a never before seen badge...

With respect, I'm afraid I'm not convinced by the "I've never seen one so they can't exist" type of argument.

For one thing, for a number of awards, Steinhauer are just about the rarest maker you can find so that fact there aren't loads of them around means nothing. There are some Steinhauer pieces where I only know of two or three in collectiosn world wide.

For another, Steinhauer catalogue illustrations are some of the most accurate you will find and show design details which are discernably distinct to that maker so I don't buy the idea of all their other illustrations being accurate and their PAB not being.

Just my opinion of course, but unless someone can establish differntly, for me this is the correct design of a Steinhauer PAB.

Just for interest, from the 1940 catalogue. here's what a Steinhauer PAB looked like.

Reverse

"50" by JFS

Reverse

Just realised that there hasn't been an FO. yet.

Reverse

A nice Zimmermann I once owned.

And the Kreissieger Badge

The Knorr Documents

U-Boat Badge

And Bartholomy himself wearing his awards

EK2 and EK1

High Seas Fleet Badge

Richard's Documents for Bartholomy

U-Boat Badge

And the doc for operating in the Arctic.

Here is the Urkunde for crossing the Equator. Interesting in being done on cloth rather than the usual paper document.

A quick look at the reverse however will disabuse you of any such notion. Die struck yes, but in one piece and with no reverse detail. Absolute crap which they refer to on their certificate as a "Museum Quality" replica.

And here is one of their stinkers. Complete with certificate of authenticity, serial numbered no less !

You could be fooled into thinking it was a reasonable quality die struck copy from this view.

Must have been an interesting uniform to see, with three war badges worn , plus the Narvik shield.

Several entries show the Fieldpost numbers M42766 (5 U-Flotille) and M50100 (U-386).

Operating out of St. Nazaire, U-386 was located by British escort HMS Spey north-north-east of the Azores and sunk with depth charges. Some of the crew were rescued but Weyel and 32 others were lost. Very few engine room crew ever escaped from stricken U-Boats.

Weyels awards included the EK2, Minesweeper Badge, Destroyer Badge, Narvik Shield, KVK2 and U-Boat badge.

Like many former Destroyer crew whose ships were lost at Narvik, Weyel transferred to U-Boats. He served on U-386, eventually reaching the rank of Maschinenmaat, still in the engine room.

On U-Boats !