Gordon Williamson

Here Gordon is a certificate I hope to at least to identify the member and its age.

Very nice ! I love these Japanese award documents, even if I don't have the faintest idea what they say !!

Unfortunately all the award docs I haved seen for sale have been with the medals, which I already have, don't seem to see the docs on their own too much.

heh heh.....

'Think further East...'

'A POW....'

Probably one clue too many...

Is it........ JAPANESE!!!

Marshall

Well done Marshall. The give away clue being that Seggermann served on a "Monsun" boat which operated out of a Japanese naval base in Penang. Most have heard of the Japanese made Auxiliary Cruiser badge, and of the EK1s with Japanese markings, but there were Knight's Crosses and DKs made out there too. Presumably sourced through the same jeweller firm in Yokahama with the help of Admiral Paul Wennecker, the German naval attache in Tokyo.

Note that the swastika can rotate around its central fixing rivet, hence the circular "score" line running around the silvered disc it sits on. No original German made piece has a swas that could rotate like this.

Otherwise a fairly faithful copy suggesting they had an original example to work from.

.....Gordon,do you think "FR" and "Fr" are just different variations of the same maker?

Micha

Micha, I suppose we are sure that Fr are the Friedlander pieces and I have seen FR quoted as Frank & Reif. The obverse cores of the Fr and FR EK1s are different but the reverse fittings, and the placement of the mark are almost identical. Thats an awfully big co-incidence. Frank & Reif described themselves as a metal stamping firm, even their WW2 badges are simple stampings in zink like the GAB, PAB. I've never seen any proof that they made the EK.

OK, the name of the recipient of this 100% original period piece may help.

Leutnant (Ing) Hugo Seggermann, Leitender Ingenieur on U-862

Two Berlin makers suggested. Lets just say the city of manufacture was a bit further East.

Look at the silver disc the swastika sits on.

Good guess Jim, but wrong. Any others ?

Study it closely, there are some clues there.

BTT. I'd forgotten about this post. No one any guesses as to the maker ?????

Very nice indeed. These grey boxes with the "push tray" are the type specifically referred to in early LDO regs as for the EK2 Spange.

Generally regarded as Wagner.

Bill, Tom, I think you are correct. !

Do we know if there are two variations of the mark ( i.e. WA and Wa) in the same way as FR and Fr.

Certainly looks like an upper case A with the apex missing.

Over a period of around 30 years from the early 70s, I have bought dozens of S&L 57 RKs, Oaks, etc, through various sources, from Uniform Outfitters, German dealers, BW Kleiderkasse, direct from S&L. Every single item, if silver, was 800 stamped, including those I got direct from S&L as late as the early 1990s.

How the 925 pieces came about (and they only seem to have appeared in very recent years) is open to argument. I'm not convinced they were made by Steinhauer. Supplied by Steinhauer maybe, but did they actually make them ???. Even in the days when they were more willing to supply 57 pieces, they weren't interested enough to offer a supply available from stock. You had to wait until they had enough orders to make the production of a small batch worthwhile. The manufacture of '57 awards today is, I would suggest, not an important, economic, part of S&Ls business.

It has been suggested that they eventually subcontracted production of their 57 stuff. Maybe. Certainly I have seen 57 pieces which had all the usual S&L '57 fittings and were supplied by them,but were cast (slightly smaller as you'd expect from castings), not die struck. Why cast them when they had the original tools to strike them ? Unless they didn't actually make them - couldn't be bothered - so subcontracted out the work to someone else who could make them cheaper as castings, then simply add their mark up.

Either way, I see the 925s as a modern "made for the collector market" phenomenon and would very much doubt any of them are more than a few years old. Those you usually see have that very modern circular dished out reverse with flat outer edge rather than the whole reverse being gently concaved as on early pieces.

(There is of course nothing intrinsically wrong with a 925 stamp on a German piece, there are many 1914 EKs that are 925 stamped).

Difficult to make out , but turning it this way it looks almost like it could be a badly struck WS with the first "leg" of the W faint.

Given how many of the 1914 EK2 marks are "unknowns" you may well have discovered a new mark.

Very nice work, Gordon! How do you keep them dusted, soft bristle brush or canned air?

Don't tell me your bride dusts them because that one won't sell...

Canned air is the only thing I'd trust on some of these. Large soft bristle job does the business on large surfaces like the U-Boat hull, but if you are talking a 1/350 piece with lots of etched brass railings, spindly masts and thin filament rigging, air's the only way to go.

The wife do it ???????? I learned long ago that wife in cleaning mode and very delicate model = total disaster.

Actually no, not resin, though I considered it. I ended up using "Polyfilla" for the "sea" (don't know what the US equivalent is) and after painting, just gave it plenty coats of clear varnish.

The model itself is solid polyurethane resin.

"Dust-magnets" this size are a real pain.

Or finding 6ft plus of space for a U-Boats at 1/35

You guys that do armour have it easy! You can get loads of detail into a model thats just a few inches long !

Try making space for ship kits at 1/72

Hi Gordon, Siedlatzek is a definate WW1 maker of Orders, Decorations and Medals

Hi Rick,

Just to clarify, I meant the Sedlatzek marked 1939 Screwback EK1s, like this one. He wasn't a 1939 maker, so added his own named screwplate to pieces he sold. I've seen 1939 EKs with Sedlatzeks details added, but which had makers marks to other firms. The example here has a Sedlatzek plate but is maker marked to Godet (L/50).

So I was just curious re the Hansen pieces as to whether we know for sure they were a maker, or may have been a retail jeweller. Either way, doesn't detract from the fact that they are damn fine pieces.

Does anybody know what the story with these pieces is? There's been a veritable plethora of these crosses that have appeared on the market in the last few months. Was there some type of "find"? Or what?

Another question. Was Hansen definitely a manufacturer , or simply a retailer (like Sedlatzek whose name can be found on screw fittings for 1939 EK1s, but was never a maker) ?

Close up

Klein logo in base

Right award Jacques, but wrong service. Its another Army one.

What kind of minty thing is hiding in this minty box ???

Nice to see pieces with a history and with character, even if they are damaged.