Tony

I'm looking forward to seeing more.

It looks ok to me.

I'll scan some details from a book later and send them on. That should help you determine which style of naming it actually is although you might need a ruler to be absolutely sure.

On 28/11/2017 at 03:42, Stuka f said:

Very nice!

Love to see the others....

Me too, anything Belgian is rarely seen.

Mate, it isn't free so pm me your email and I'll send the papers over. There's nothing exciting there but it tells you a little about the man behind the medal.

Tony

Great lot of badges there Jerry. I started collecting various cap badges back in the 90s only to find at a later date that many were restrikes, that put me off them.

Tony, do you know Hewitt has two sets of records online? Under his 61598 number and 39204 too.

If the medals weren't issued/applied for originally then the next of kin can still apply for them. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/applying-for-medals

As for naming them yourself well, if they're staying with you to remember your grandfather then engraving them would probably be better than stamping.

Alternatively if you apply for his service record or already have it, perhaps placing his official medal entitlement with the medals will be ok.

Personally I'd frame them with a photo of your grandfather but either way, they're yours so do whatever you feel at ease with.

18 hours ago, peter monahan said:

Lovely that you've found your answers! 

And I suppose it's too late to claim that I thought I remembered the RA having 'Corprorals' at some popint, isn't it?

Peter

And being promoted from Bombadier to Corporal makes me wonder if Corporal was something between Bdr. and Sgt.

Possibly. If you check page 4 of his record it looks like he was in Ahmdednuggur from 1885 to the end of 1887 although the writing is difficult to understand in places.

A pity we're none the wiser about F/1 but do you have his medals?

I can download the whole record if you like, just pm me your email and I'll sort it out in the morning.

50 minutes ago, chapster76 said:

Just found a reference that Royal Artillery did have Corporals up until 1920? That suggests RA could still fit?

Ok, was he from Peterborough too?

There’s a Cpl. William Hall Royal Artillery from Peterborough who was transferred to the reserve in Dec. 1888 after 12 years service.

His promotions are interesting with respect to ranks in the RA:

Gnr. – 1881 to 83

Actg. Bbr. -1883 to 83

Bombr. – 1883 to 1885

Corporal – 1885 to 1888

Served India 1883 – 1888 

His Corps and regimental number changed from 1^st Bde. RA, 9089 to F/i (or F/1) 14516 but I can’t tell if this happened after his transfer to the reserve in Dec. 1888 or previous to that. And I've no idea what the meaning of F/i (F/1) is on the attached extract is or if I've gone completely off track.

12 hours ago, coldstream said:

Just an observation but wouldn't a Corporal be called a Bombardier in the Royal Artillery? Perhaps we need to look further afield?

Regards Simon.

Doh! I didn't even think about that.

On 18/10/2017 at 00:34, peter monahan said:

Absent strong evidence to the contrary, I'd say 'R.A.' is 'Royal Artillery', so that leaves the 'F/t' to puzzle out.  Perhaps 'From the R.A.'?

Looking at a very extensive list of military abbreviations doesn't suggest anything more likely than 'Royal Artilery' and nothing at all for 'F/t'.  'Fd' is 'Field, as in artillery, and 'FT' is French Translator but neither of those is relevant so... ???

Peter, I did find reference to a Frontier Force Royal Artillery yesterday however, I've just searched William Hall born 1860 and came up with three men, none of them being above the rank of Pte.

Chapster, do these three men named William Hall, born 1860 ring any bells? I couldn't see that any of them had the rank of Corporal.

751 William Hall, 21^st Brig. then transferred to 43 Light Infantry, born Wem, Shropshire. Married Elizabeth Keay in 1884 and stayed ‘Home’ until his discharge in 1890. He also served at Depot, Ox. & Bucks LI.

2668 William Hall, 1/23 Fusiliers, born in Bermondsey, in the Burmah Field Force in 1888, record shows India 1880-1888, campaign Burmah.

1797 William Hall, 34^th Brig., born St. Pauls, discharged 1890 and was ‘Home’ in 1888.

By the way, there'll be many, many men named William Hall but the above were the only ones showing up as born in 1860.

Hopefully someone who knows will be along to solve this but just having a guess here, could F/t be something to do with Frontier?

Do you know anything about the unit he was in?

Tony

I'd have thought French at first too however, it does resemble the Mujahid Force (formed in the 1960s) cap badge so perhaps a Pakistani connection?

If you're looking at Brit WWI campaign medals you might also want to look here for Medal Index Cards  http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=1262

Ancestry's search engine is terrible but it's free so I shouldn't complain https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/1262/30850_A001491-02262?pid=5440763&backurl=http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DCmT81%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource%26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26indiv%3D1%26db%3DMedalRolls%26gss%3Dangs-d%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26msT%3D1%26gsfn%3Drobert%26gsfn_x%3D1%26gsln%3Dstockbridge%26gsln_x%3D1%26MSAV%3D1%26uidh%3Da9g%26pcat%3D39%26fh%3D0%26h%3D5440763%26recoff%3D9%2010%26ml_rpos%3D1&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=CmT81&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true

He probably received his medals in the early 20s however, most service records were destroyed in WWII and those that survived aren't always in good condition so the exact date he received the VM is unknown.

Sorry I can't help with the authenticity but is it one of the sellers who usually has a supply of cruiser helmets, 1917 dated imperial German flags and WWI and WWII dated Commonwealth flags, some with an upside down union flag in the corner?

Where did you find the info on him? I could only find him listed as killed in the late August 1918 edition of the Verlustlisten.

Babetta Hurrell/Horrell? doesn't sound typically German so I wonder where he met her. That and the info you have makes a simple card very interesting.

I've just searched online and it appears to be 90% silver, assayed in Cairo some time from 1946 onwards.

Have a look at the 3rd post here http://925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23514

A nice lot. Have you been able to research any of them?

All I could find with a quick search was that he was captured in CM North Africa 20/4/43 and spent time in camp 4DZ in Annaburg, his POW number was 227036 which confirms what you already know. 

He was also in camp 98, Italy, according to wikipedia it was in San Guiseppe Jato. He was obviously in Stalag IVB, Muehlberg too so I'd have a guess at him being held in Italy, then Muehlberg before moving on to Annaburg. http://www.lager-muehlberg.org/index_e.html

Perhaps finding where his unit was (67 Field Regt.) in April 43 might help with the actual place he was captured. I don’t know the meaning of C.M. North Africa, if it’s an area or not.

His military record will need to be applied for. There's also a cost involved and I'm not sure but think payment can only be made by UK cheque which is a pain for anyone who isn't UK resident. A copy of his death certificate will be necessary which is an additional cost, details here https://www.gov.uk/get-copy-military-service-records/apply-for-someone-elses-records

Forgot to say, a nice group and fantastic start to a WWII medal collection.

Thanks for the positive comments, even yours Chris as 3 layers are always worth thinking about.

A shame it isn't complete and it'd be nice if the nose cap was there as I've also got a pretty decent relic 07 bayonet. It came from the Somme but I just wonder where it actually came out of the ground.

On 04/07/2017 at 23:40, peter monahan said:

 in the extremely unlikely event that our minds went in that [low] direction, remembered the place and our roots -

[Actually, it was my first thought too, but...  ]

Luckily Chris does't speak Australian slang

So, a couple of pics are below but it's not the easiest thing to photograph.

I gave the butt a light rub with wirewool which only removed to loose stuff and the rest has been oiled rather than waxed, thanks for the tip Brian.

Just in case anyone is wondering - the magazine is empty.

Thanks for the replies and I'm pleased to hear my thoughts of what to use were along the right lines. The metalwork is dark so has no doubt had some kind of treatment like electrolysis, which is why I was thinking about waxing the butt.

I'll go with a light butt rub (no doubt music to Chris' ears) to remove the loose bits and then leave it, wax can be rubbed into the woodwork at a later date if necessary.

As for the metal well, I'll probably put some beeswax on that to prevent it turning back to orange in the little nooks and crannies and will add a photo in a day or two.

Has anyone had a go at preserving an old piece of wood that's been underground for a good few years?

I was thinking of some 00 wirewool and a coating of linseed oil or maybe rubbing in some beeswax, but at the same time I don't want it losing that been in a tunnel the past 100 years look.

Thanks for any suggestions.

Tony

On 11/06/2017 at 18:34, Dave Danner said:

For the 1870 version, there were several EK1/EK2w combinations, but the 1870 EK2 was routinely awarded on the white-black ribbon to medical personnel, which was not the case with the 1914 version.

Dave, I have an EKI 14 to a doctor and always imagined he would've received the non-com. ribbon with his EKII, thanks for putting me right with the above comment.