redeagleorder

Saw this one for sale as well. Beau's right, the bars are for a WW1 veteran's medal.

Regards,

Matthew

Really? Don't wartime awards always come before peace time awards, regardless of the state? And would it be possible for a Prussian to receive an Oldenburg/Mecklenburg award yet not receive recognition from Prussia itself (I know it also depends on the regiment, but still!)?

Regards,

Matthew

The photos are here. Troy, all you have to do is copy and paste.

Regards,

Matthew

Hi Wild Card,

You're right, it could be... . Bu the precedence is still wrong. And i don't know if you've seen the seller, but he is our great friend appollo124.

Regards,

Matthew

Pinpon says it all. WOW

Regards,

Matthew

Hi Troy,

I based my argument on two main reasons. First of all, the precedence of the medals is completely wrong. The Mecklenburg Military Merit Cross should be first, followed by the 1870 commemorative medal, and finally the 1897 Centenary medal. Even if it is a frackspange (which is read backwards), the precendence is still wrong as the 1897 medal is in the middle.

Secondly, the Mecklenburg MVK is on a non-combatant ribbon. However, the 1870 Commemorative is the bronze-coloured one which was awarded to combatants, and not the steel-coloured one awarded to non-combatants (these two medals also had different ribbons, and the ribbon on this one matches the combatant medal). Therefore, he bar is saying that the man served as a non-combatant during the war, yet after the war he is being classified as a combatant. A bit implausible, no?

I think it is fake simply on those two points, without delving into the medal's look, as well as the form and type of construction of the bar (in which I am no expert).

Regards,

Matthew

The number of fakes on ebay is infinite, but this one stands out particularly

Regards

Matthew

Wow. Impressive enamel work,as well as the detail on the lion.

Regards,

Matthew

Lovely medal, and the case is very uniquely shaped.

Regards,

Matthew

Not only is it so beautiful, but it is also older than most other miniatures, yet is still perfect.

Regards,

Matthew

Just to add my voice with eveyone else's. I have known Stogieman far less long than the others who have already commented,but from the posts that I have seen he is, like everyone else on this forum except an unfortunate few, a true gentleman who often helps others with their queries or questions. On the other hand, I have never seen you give a positive contribution. Now on to the subject of the bars. If you really are gerst, then shame on you for copying ribbon bars shown on this website for you own gain. Stogieman has a number of bars for sale on this very website, and do you really think that if they were fake they wouldn't be recognised?

Good day to you, sir,

Matthew

Edit: I didn't manage to see Claudius's post above before posting, so if you have a brilliant explanation this is withdrawn.

i was just trawling through the old threads when I saw the above post. I've often thought of the idea of establishing a database on GMIC so that fake sellers can be exposed, to prevent collectors from spending their money on junk. What do you think, for example is it against any privacy laws to post the names of ebay sellers?

Regards,

Matthew

The back:

Good luck with the restoration. I just finished restoring a non-combatant bar pictured below. Its my first and only bar, so I hope I did a good job.

Regards,

Matthew

Hi Matt,

Glad to hear it. It would make a nice addittion to your already lovely collection.

Best of luck with it,

Matthew

Wow, that is a really beautiful miniature bar. The detail on such small pieces, particularly the enamel, is stunning.

Regards,

Matthew

Here is the one I posted about earlier.

Regards,

Matthew

Right now there is another Lubeck-Saxony ribbon bar on ebay, but I can't find the picture.... Congrats on yours, it is very nice.

Regards,

Matthew

Wow :love: . I really love these awards, their shape combined with the gold and blue colouring of the higher classes makes them really distinctive. Both of the are a treasure!

Matthew

Hi Troy,

From what I can see those are Luipold Jubilee medal and a bavria long service decoration. Unfortunately there were two types of the Luitpold medal were awarded on the same ribbon, one in 1905 and the other in 1911, so it is near impossible to tell which. The bavarian service medals were also all awarded on the same ribbon, but if he was an officer, as suggested by Dave Danner, the most likely candidate is the 24 year service cross.

You can find more details about the Luipold Jubilee Medal at this link: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/10260-bayern-prinz-regent-luitpold-jubilaeums-medaille/page__p__463874__hl__+luitpold%20+medal#entry463874

and more details about the bavaria service medals and crosses here: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/33516-confusion-about-bavarian-service-distinction-cross/

Apart from that, really nice bandschleifen. I really like the mecklenburg and hanseatic military awards.

Regards,

Matthew

Hi Mezzit, and welcome to the forum!

In answer to your question, I know it is non-combatant because the King Ludwig cross and the war aid medal (second and third ribbons respectively) were only given out to non-combatants, such as doctors, etc... The hindenburg cross ribbon could also mean a non-combatant, and the fourth ribbon, the Prinzregent Luitpold medal was also given out to medical officers. A service medal also points towards a doctor. In answer to your order of wear question, I also was curious about that, but if you go into the non-combatant thread (just below this one) you will see that there are examples of the hindenburg cross being placed before the war aid cross.

As to your other questions, I would like to know the answer to them myself!!!! In fact, I would like to add one more!!!! Is he Luitpold medal the bronze one without the crown or the ornate one with the crown???

Mezzit, once again welcome to the forum. Know that asking questions is simply a part of the learning process, and other collectrs are your best sources of information!

Regards,

Matthew

Hi Matt,

It is theoretically possible that it is a 20 year service cross if he joined in 1897 and was awarded the three merit medals in 1914/1915, and died soon after. This would explain the lack of a hindenburg cross. However, it is far more likely that it is a 25 year service cross, especially since war years counted double. He might have been a recalled officer, especially since there are no colonial medals. And in answer to your last question, I don't know how to tell the years of service just by the ribbon.

Regards

Matthew

Never mind, seller says only postage to Germany

Regards,

Matthew

Hi Ulsterman,

Yeah, the medals are attached with hooks on the back, probably the reason all its medals are missing in the first place. In fact i was thinking of buying it to fix it up, but there seems to be mixed feelings on that type of 'restoration'. But just to know, would the long service medal be a regular one or a landwehr one due to the luitpold medal and the fact that it is non-combatant? And also due to the luitpold medal issued in 1905, assume the long service medal is a 15 year one.....

By the way, as I just realised, should the hindenburg cross be in front, considering that the King Ludwig cross and the War Aid cross were both issued during the war? And would the Luitpold medal be the 'normal' one or the one with the crown on top. To be honest I don't know the difference between the two

Thanks a lot for your time and patience,

Matthew

Not fake per se, but messed up. Must have been a nice non-combatant bar once.

Regards,

Matthew