Jim Maclean

The red on blue wings are worn by RM on the wooly pully I think - I got some from a Commando unit in NI years ago, & I think a pair from a RM Commando (a Falklands MM winner from the Arctic & Mountain Cadre or whatever it was called & whose sister was at uni with the ex mrs).

Interesting, I spent my last two years (77-79) in the mob with the RM and they all wore army type wooly pullies with the army type wings. Only ever knew one MAWC guy who was with the section at Poole. The only Cdo unit I can think of that would have them would be 148 Bty RA whose radio ops were all matelots but you never saw them in blue anyway. Interesting! Incidentally the RN never wore them on the blue wooly pully or any other trade or SQ badge, only rank badges. Interestingly I noticed Camilla's beau at I think last years Remeberance service wearing his Para wings army fashion on his frock coat on the right upper arm. Perhaps this is because he already wears aviators wings on his left cuff but may be because he do what he likes. Only time I've ever seen the wing worn this way by a matelot apart from the aforementiontioned radio ops who dressed like squaddies anyway.

As to the cap badge, time to dig out the die flaw pics again Not to mention the slider is dodgy on a K/C badge and probably on a white metal Q/C though I do think I've seen the staybright with a slider.

Definitely agree on the cap badges being repro.

Top right of the para wings is/was worn on RN No2s/4s, can't ever recall seeing bootnecks wearing it. The blue on white below it is worn on No 6 tropical dress, though I believe the uniform numbering system has recently been changed. Worn in the RN on the left cuff.

I always remember going to the local cinema in the 60s, 2/6 off Dad, anything unspent at the cinema was spent in a glory hole called The Old Curiosity Shop with a wonderful old chap by the name of Mr Poole. He had drawers and drawers full of army cap badges, old silks, Khaki slip on titles, embroidered titles all I suspect the real deal. He had one really expensive badge which was circular with 1LG 2LG GG...........get the drift? He wanted a whole 5 bob for that and I didn't know what it was. No good books around then. He also had the most beautiful hallmarked silver plaid brooch badge for the A&SH complete with cat and boar for ?20. Unfortunately he passed away just after I joined up. Where all his stuff went I don't know. He also rolls and rolls of medal ribbon going back to the QSA. Amazing place.

They only do that at the christmas office party.........

That's the nice ones. I hold my hands up to not wiping it off for a while.

They are superb. What's the history? i.e. Who, when, why etc.

If you see any Dorsetshire Regt. or indeed any RMA or RMLI give me a shout.

Think it's 13th as they had buff collars according to the 1901 Dress Regs.

The left hand & centre buttons are King George V ? the cipher of King George VI draws in slightly at the bottom rather than widens slightly as these do.

The right hand button is King Edward VII, his cypher is similarly shaped to that of K George V, narrowing at the top.

Buttons were issued for King Edward VIII?s reign, & his cypher is similar to QE II?s but more crowded & squarer looking in the middle., & their ciphers don?t narrow at the top like King Edward VII?s.

What else have we got in Davey Jones's locker?

Yes, I just noticed the bits of stuff there - Old Navy Shag steeped in rum or something like that?

Thanks for the info Leigh. On the other I wish I had bits of stuff sitting on my scanner, more than likely an Old Navy Shag

I've just shovelled out the space under the stairs and come up with these three GG buttons. I think that these are all I've got but who knows what lurks in unexplored drawers. Are they George V or George VI and is the other Ted VII or Ted VIII ? What do you think Leigh? I haven't a clue. At least these give CB an idea of what to look for. I'm pretty sure that the buttons on the front of the jacket would be the larger (25mm-ish) and the epaulette buttons the smaller (19mm-ish) ones

Must clean that scanner bed .

As you like them so much here's an Officer's silver plate badge.

I think the BW wore their badge on a black rosette, might be wrong though.

Looks pretty good to me. Well worth taking apart and killing that awful verdigris.

Another one. This is probably an early badge, this has the tail visible and is slightly wider at the top. My guess is that this one is no later than 1908. Note also the cross over of the bottom thistles

Sorry Andrew, seems like you've been hijacked!

I really must put together something that shows the many connections that the collar badge shows. For me it is far more informative than the cap/glengarry badge, the only thing it misses out is the coronet of Princess Louise. That's probably represented by the 'bar' above the cat and boar. The cap badge however doesn't have the myrtle and broom just a surround of thistles. Already the largest badge in the British army (known as the mess tin) a few sprigs here and there would not have gone amiss.

If you're thinking of getting shot of those collars think Jim

Another cap badge

Here's the cap badge, totally genuine, it was on his head at Dunkirk.

That one on the left looks like a kangaroo, not a cat!!!

It's a Sutherland mountain cat, you should see those buggers jump

I've had a look through Churchill and to be honest you'd have difficulty dating these badges from the book. It appears to support my original theory of the age, but not quite, the upright tail was used later, see mine below. I think that this was produced in the 30s or 40s due to the lugs on the reverse and it has a tail.

I think this is the best collar badge produced, it is so rich in symbolism. Myrtle, broom, cat and boar are representative of so many clans in such a lovely badge. I do admit to a little bias as this was the regiment my father served with in WW2.

The cypher and crowns are those of Queen Victoria i.e. pre 1901. I don't know of any instance though of a crown either side of the royal cypher though and suspect this may be an amalgamation of three seperate badges. Very unusual

There are many variations of the Argyll's collar badges and indeed the cap badge. Most revolve around the cat, whether he is facing or side on, tail up or sitting on his tail, the expression on the face etc. There are also variations in the boar's head. From what I remember the badge at left is post 1902 due to the tail not being visible and the one on the right being pre 1902 due to the upright tail. Interesting to note that the right hand badge has been brooched probably as a sweetheart item.

I'll dig out Churhill's collar badge book and see if I can come up with a better date match for you.

Kev this is my Connaught Rangers glengarry badge which is a fake.

Note the die flaws which are filled in setions that should not be there. If yours has these then I'm afraid it's a wrong un. If it's different the chances are it's good.

Jim

Thanks for that Chris, I'm afraid I'm not that familiar with the organisation of the Volunteers.

i look forward to seeing it!

Me too Peter, don't forget

Chris, I'm a bit baffled by a Surgeon Major wearing an infantry HP. I believe there was a RAMC volunteers. I'm not doubting, just confused and seeking a bit of clarification.

That's a gem Chris.

Why the ball top though? I'd always associated them with Arms and Services rather than infantry. I've a couple of helmet plates but not the helmet. I'm definitely starting to 'feel the need'. There's room in the cabinet or would be if I got one

Yes they are going to vary in price mostly on condition. The badge was generally a generic star with a removable Helmet Plate Centre (HPC), you can pick these up on that online auction site but be aware the HPCs and the Helmet Plates are reproduced. The fakers are doing a pretty good job as there doesn't seem to be that many surviving examples of the real thing, and nobody seems to be getting into the identification of these fakes yet.

Royal Engineers and Royal Artillery also wore this helmet but the helmet plate was a variation on the Royal Arms and the helmet had a ball top rather than a spike.

Officers helmets had gilt fittings and a different pattern plate, other ranks were brass. Volunteers, Militia and Territorials had white metal fittings as shown in the scan provided by Ulsterman, a nice officers Home Service Helmet to the 7th Hampshires or their predecessors. Very scarce and would cost an arm and a leg.

As for the helmet itself being faked, I did see a reference on another site and can't remember for the life of me but it concerns the number of segments the helmet is made from. They aren't fakes they're police helmets made to look like HS helmets.

Unless you particularly want an attributed example go for the best condition helmet and add the plate of your choice. Military auctioneers such as Wallis and Wallis, Bosley's etc have got to be the better bet.

Jim

I think these were produced by the Franklin Mint in the 80s or maybe a little earlier. Each one came with a Crown size silver medallion. I can't remember how many were in the set but when you bought the whole series you got a 'free' wooden case to display them in.

I have the Buffs badge somewhere and it looks identical to the one you show.

As far as I'm aware the VBs and TF collar badges did not have the Egypt honour below the sphinx

The only helpful references to the motto (We give and seek in return) I can find is for British Guyana. They do have a 'Blue Ensign' for use by Crown vessels. Perhaps this is from the local defence force.

An assistant to the Master at Arms, holding the rate of Petty Officer.

Bit more info here,

HMS Diomede

The only other interesting little snippet, to be filed under 'useless info' is that the funnel markings show her as 'half leader' (2 i/c) of the 1st Frigate Squadron. That's the white edged black band over the numeral '1'. The senior ship in the squadron had the funnel painted black from where the bottom of that band is. All other members just had the black cap to hide the soot stains. All wore the squadron numeral.