Medaller

Hello everyone,

It's been a long time since I have been here, I used to collect Soviet medals and orders and Australian WW1 and 2 medals.

But today it's a personal one that's related to the Royal Navy. I know very little about RN records, so am hoping to get some information as to whether there is anymore out there than what I have found. But to the story........

I have spent a lot of time on my family tree. Years. But there is one branch that has constantly alluded me. It's the question of who my paternal grandfathers father is.

My grandfathers birth certificate had very little information, but I have just finally got his brothers certificate after having to wait for the 100 year anniversary of his birth (Australian law). Finally I got something that gave me a break. Henry Joseph Rawlings. I have found the man, but many parts are missing.

The Henry Joseph Rawlings in question was (allegedly) born on 20 December 1893 in Melbourne, Australia. However I cannot find a birth certificate for him.

What I did find was a WW1 document that shows that he was a Stoker 1st Class on HMS Tiger during the Battle Of Jutland. He was severely wounded on 31 May 1916 and according to the document was transferred to the Royal Australian Navy and on to HMAS Australia. There is some other writing that I cant make out.

I know that this is my great grandfather due to a paper trail. He signed a child maintenance agreement in 1923 in regards to my grandfather and his brother, but skipped almost straight away.

In 1929, a warrant went out for his arrest as he owed about 230 pounds (an amount that I once worked out means that he either never paid a cent or maybe made one or two payments). His police description states that he is a ships fireman and has a large coat of arms tattooed on his chest. The WW1 RN file states he has the Australian coat of arms tattooed on his chest.

His Royal Australian Navy file shows up under WW2 instead of WW1 for some reason in the Australian archives, but it does show the same date and place of birth. It shows he joined the RAN on 13.9.16 for a period of 7 years and also says "RN service not known". While it mentions his scars, it doesn't mention tattoos. However its clearly the same person given the DOB and the change over date being not long after Jutland. He received a hurt certificate in 1918, so presumably saw out the war on HMAS Australia.

I am wondering if anyone could tell me if there might be any other British records for him ? I am not very familiar with the British Records system, so thought I would be better asking. I can see that he is going to be a mystery man as I can find no Australian birth certificate. I did of course wonder if he was in fact British given that he is born in 1893 and in 1915 is serving in the Royal Navy. But what British man would have the Australian coat of arms tattooed on his chest ?

I am a long time member, but rarely visit due to not being an active collector anymore.

Having said that, I run and have run since 1997 a forum larger than this one of a different subject topic.

Once very profitable, a refusal to abide by Google's Adsense demands on content cost me that income. Forums have also of course suffered from the introduction of social media.

So how do I pay my forums bills ? Premium Membership. $20 a year. If you put the call out, you will find most regulars will put their hand in their pocket. And give them better access to things that standard members get, those on the fence will then likely decide its worthwhile.

You can get her service file unlocked online for $36.27 AUD if you are really interested, but it is likely her only medal and she would not have served overseas. Other than that there isn't much else to tell without paying. Her service file will likely have a photo and will have her enlistment papers showing age, height, weight etc and will also show everywhere she served.

She enlisted 05 Oct 1942 and was discharged 08 Jun 1945. At discharge she was a corporal at 6 STORES DEPOT.

If you Google " RAAF 6 Stores Depot " you will see exactly where she was working. It is in Dubbo, New South Wales and is heritage listed. Wikipedia snippet below :

"By April 1943, all 27 buildings at the Dubbo Stores Depot were also complete, and stores were arriving daily. The site was used to store aeroplane parts, wireless equipment, ammunition and bombs. By June 1945 there were approximately 866 men and women personnel, both military and civilian, employed by the RAAF in their six sites in the town of Dubbo"

Cheers

Medaller

Dear Forum

not sure how the link got broken above here are Carl's Medals

How amazing to have a response from a living relative forum power!

Paul

Hello Paul

I hope this doesnt come across the wrong way, but have you considered asking Stan Osbourne if he and the family are interested in the medals ?

Their dollar value is low , but I am sure the sentimental value to the family would be high.

Regards

Andrew

I have in my possession a WW1 Navy Meritorious Service Medal on the rim it say's "HMAS Sydney" for services during war. it also gives the sailors name. i believe only 5 of these medals were struck and were given for service during the battle with SMS Emden.

I also have his 1914-15 star British war medal and victory medal

does anyone have a clue what this medal or medals would be worth, the sailors last living relative want's to sell them but i don't know whats a fair price.

I'm hoping someone can help..thanks

Can you post up some pictures please? Its far too hard to make judgements without them. What makes you think only 5 wherever made?

Mervyn,

You would be entitled to the National Service Medal, and the Australian Defence Medal I think. You should apply for them,

they will give you a nice little reminder of your time here in Oz way back when....

Cheers

Bob

Absolutely, Mervyn should apply and get them. Its never too late. One of my grandfathers claimed his ww2 medals in 2006 and the other in the mid 90's.

Over 100 years late combined

_{He was a Sergeant in the 2/24 Infantry: http://www.ww2roll.gov.au/Veteran.aspx?ServiceId=A&VeteranId=437685. He was killed in action July 23, 1942.}

_{An excellent website here: http://2-24.battalion.org.au/rolls/roll.html}

_Michael

Looks like I got a bit excited and forgot about the original question

He was killed in Alamein against the Germans. Although the 2/24 got a bit mauled, they inflicted worse on the germans with a conservative estimate of 250 german casualties.

Hi,

Interesting.

I would assume that members of the Citizen Military Force could to transfer to the AIF if they wanted too? Or would they have to resign from one and then enlist in the other?

Jerry

In WW2, many militia men (CMF) transferred to the AIF, some records state as to where joined AIF from CMF as " transferred in the field ".

Many of these would have been in New Guinea, where both the CMF and AIF fought together on the Kokoda Track (New Guinea was as far as the CMF were allowed to go as New Guinea was then an Australian territory). AIF troops were far better trained and equipped than militia troops, some militia troops fighting the Japanese at Kokoda only fired a rifle for the first time on the troopship or at New Guinea. Some from the CMF 53rd battalion were only 18 and were conscripted on to the troopship without getting to say goodbye to family. They thought they were going to Darwin but the ship went to Port Moresby.

When transferring you would lose your militia number and be issued with an AIF number.

And just to go a little further for information purposes......

In Australia at the start of WW 2, Australia's main defence force was the AMF (Australian Military Forces, known unofficially as the militia). The AMF were limited in that by law they were only allowed to serve in Australia or its territories (the militia or "chockos*" as they were called by AIF (Australian Imperial Forces) soldiers are famous for their battles with the Japanese on the Kokoda Track as New Guinea was an Australian territory at the time). The AIF was created to serve overseas as professional soldiers.

AMF soldiers had similar serial numbers to the AIF but minus the X. Many AMF soldiers joined the AIF in the field.

* AIF soldiers called AMF soldiers "chockos" as an abbreviation for chocolate soldiers.....they believed they would melt in the heat of battle. This was certainly proved wrong

Thats a great find, I have never heard of any similar. I wonder if he tried to join the AIF ? ( His number shows he was in the CMF (militia) )

This sounds a very interesting story - it would be nice to learn a little more about these courageous men. It seems rather reminiscent of the scene in 'South Pacific' where they took over from an Aussie Coast Watcher ?

p.s. - sorry Medaller - should have said welcome to GMIC. Tell us a little about yourself and what you collect ?

Thanks Mervyn. I collect a lot of stuff, mainly Australian WW1 though a bit of Australian WW2 as well....I cant help myself.

Australian WW1 medals are eaily researched yourself as the Australian Government has all WW1 service records (and more) online.

I did also collect russian medals/orders though I havent for quite a while due to the fakers making it too hard for me.

Australia has many war heroes similar to the above that most of the rest of the world have never heard of.

Some further info here on wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jock_McLaren

Truly a legend.