Dudeman

Interesting piece to say the least.

Although it falls close to the transition range both chronologically (1943/1944) and by serial number, the switch to suspension occurred around 30.000. This piece's S/N is in the 60K range. I can understand maybe a few hundred, or even thousand pieces (such as the RB swallow tail you mention and discussion in the Order of Lenin book) to be reworked from the old screwback version to the suspension piece, but some 30K+ after the transition seems quite a stretch.

Nice discussion piece.

Cursive is always fun to decipher in any language - Leonid Petrovich Filippov.

Run away, real fast. The badge is not up to the high standards of real badges. The edges should fit better and the nut/reverse looks like crap. The document is equally bogus - I've seen stacks of these booklets in Kiev. These are also discussed in length on another forum - PM and I can send you the web address.

Anyone have any thoughts about the "special" engine? I've got a feeling that he was working on the Soviet's first jet engines, because the timing would be just about right....

My guess is the "special engines" were confiscated German trophy engines. Look at the period mentioned when he was assigned to the 1st Belorussian Front - his "spets" mission was to scarf up all the technology the Soviets came upon.

For Luchinsky, I love his early awards - RBL in '28, and an RB in '29!

Not just any Red Banner of Labor, but an UZBEK one.

Your mystery word is "kontrnastupayushimi" (or counterattacking) modifying the two subsequent units.

Here is a russian text to the badge (number 1.2.3.34). Maybe some of the russian speakers could be so friendly to summarise the information in English.

Summary of information relevant to the badge:

GUSHOSDOR (Abbreviation I'm guessing to be State (GU) Transportation (SHOS & DOR) Bureau, a subordinate part of the NKVD(MVD)) was involved with a series of road and building construction projects. Those excelling during these construction projects were awarded silver and bronze versions of these badges. The organization GUSHOSDOR organization existed until 18 MAR 53 when those duties were transferred to the Ministry of Automobile Transportation and Highways.

Isn't that an Airborne beret, BTW? If that's a homemade "look I was in airborne badge" it's a rather impressive piece!

The beret is for airborne (although a little bluer than usual), as is the smaller metal insignia on the red field of the larger badge in question. Airborne troops did wear a similar "banner" device to the one in question, especially in parades, but the usual design is of the cheap, stamped medal version. This one looks a little more substantial - thus lending me to believe it is a homemade "dembel" (or demobilized soldier) badge.

Does it appear to be mass-produced? If not, it was probably made by an airborne soldier at the end of his service in an effort to "puff up" his uniform for the ride home. This was commonly done in the Soviet Army with all sorts of homemade insignia, improvements on basic insignia, colored backgrounds, etc.

Hi Dudeman,

Ha, ha!!! You are making the same "mistake" I made ... Bryan is talking about the caption at the back of the pic in post #1.

Cheers.

Ch.

Oh, now I get it. I was never accused of being the brightest light bulb.

Anyone is able to translate the picture please?

Obverse reads "Ready for Labor and Defense"

Reverse "Mondvor" -- "Mint" where medals are struck

Something that I somehow missed over the years: They actually wrote "ДПР - в СССР". I don't remember ever being told or reading that Vietnam considered itself either a current or pending republic of the USSR.

Unusual and rare photo to say the least.

There is nothing wrong with "DRV v SSSR". This just refers to the Peoples Republic of Vietnam embassy being IN the USSR, not OF the USSR or PART OF the USSR.

* * * * *

Does anyone else have any of these Otlichnik documents? If you do, I'd like to see them.

Speaking of documents, are they welcome and of interest on this forum? I mean, documents without accompanying hardware or that never had accompanying hardware.

Chuck

I've never seen a road builder document, but I've seen 3-4 other strictly military documents. The ones I've seen are not specially printed documents like yours, but typed out on military unit stationery and signed by the commander. You've got something rarer than hen's teeth.

The green VDNKh ribbon I mentioned in frame 2 is pictured in frame 6. It is most likely the ribbon you are seeking.

The green ribbon could be from the VDNKh award. That may explain why it is after all the military awards save the one at the bottom which he may have applied even later.

The serial number surprises me, since it hardly seems likely they can have started at "1" and gotten to that point! I wonder what the point or purpose of such extremely high numbers would be? Is the back the usual blank Soviet style with just the number impressed?

The word "desyatok" means "ten", but would best be translated as "dozens of" something.

The red covered award cards may have been issued to Victory Parade participants and support people, and then opened up to others.

A "pro" for the theory is the four red-covered ones I've seen are all signed by general officers. I've got one in front of me signed by a General Staff 1-star and dated 23 JUN 45. The card is numbered #00056649. I also THINK I remember seeing a full cavalier set with a red-covered victory booklet. The soldier's bio mentioned his marching in the Victory Parade. I'm 70% sure on this one.

A "con" is, I could find none of the four participants in books listing veterans who had marched in the actual parade. Granted I don't have a complete listing, but I have books and journals listing at least several hundred of the actual participants.

Good discussion.

3. Excellent badges 1957

In April 1957 the minister of defence established 3 new excellent badges. One for the army, one for the air force and one for the navy. They replaced the 24 different excellent badges.

3 dates from excellent badges are missing. Help needed!

excellent fireman

excellent aviation experts (2 varations)

remark: the excellent fireman badge was the only badge which was further awarded after 1957 when the excellent badges were replaced by the three badges.

I agree with all assessments above - it's bad. From the color of the enamel to the lack of wear on the front and the inevitable fuzz and grime that should be evident stuck in between the rays on the obverse. The reverse patina is the oily, grimy fake and I've never seen a period screwback plate that huge. Usually, the "o" in "No" is written higher, not low, but there are exceptions.

The faker picked a NKVD "Criminal Investigation" badge (first "hook" to grab your attention), secondly picked a low serial number so you justify to yourself why it isn't in any reference books (because you become convinced only a small number were made) and the next thing you know, you're putting down money for it.

Thanks Dudeman,

How can one tell the difference in the two?(WW2 and post war)

I guess I should clarify. The veterans badges are ALL manufactured post-war, usually in the 70's 80's and 90's, but I've seen some as late as 2003. I can't imagine many more will be made since there won't be enough surviving unit members to warrant a badge.

The WWII veterans badges do not have prices on the back since they weren't for sale and usually had an accompanying document, though these often get separated from the badge. I have only about 30-40 documents.

The WWII veterans badges were given to veterans and often have place names or battles where the unit fought or even display the word "VETERAN" boldly.

Post WWII-unit badges such as these ship badges were meant for unit gifts or mementoes.

As to whether these ship badges are fantasy, it's possible. I haven't seen anything other than their "cheaper" manufacturer, but I've also seen corresponding "cheap" manufacture on even official issue badges.

As to the whether the ship badges are fantasy pieces or not, I guess it is possible.

Here is my contribution... Are mine WW2?

Post-war.

Unit/veteran badges: Couple of better made for WW2 examples in here:

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=964

or ones like these? (my recent ones are all naval or naval border guards, from Leningrad)

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[attachmentid=15663]

I have both types, but I mean the WWII ones. I'm working on a book and currently have about 300 (two of the three pictured on your link). I know it is impossible to get all of them, but figure it is a starting point for those that are interested.

Does anyone collect veteran znachki? By that I mean the aluminimum badges made from the 70s through in 2000s for veterans, usually indicating the unit to which the soldier belonged.