avadski

Last one says that both the award certificate and cross are copies for collectors. At least some honesty there.

Another one from same seller...

Hi,

how can you tell it's an 1870 commemorative medal and not 1935 honor cross? There appears to be the centenary medal at the very end - that would perhaps mark his start date around 1897. I can imagine a long service cross for 24 years next to it...

Just asking and trying to learn as i'm no expert on these 🍺

Thanks Andreas for looking that up! Unbelievable that it's real. 

I spotted this on reddit - supposedly a bar that belonged to Major Hermann Miller, an adjutant to prince Rupprecht. Some internet sources say that Ruprecht's adjutant was actually Otto von Stetten (pictured with his medal bar on the B&W photograph below) but Rupprecht probably had couple of adjutants during his lifetime so who knows. Nevertheless is the bar ok? Or is it just one of those monster bars sometimes offered on eBay? 19 awards must have been pretty uncomfortable to carry.

Original link:

Styria has lots of white/green ribbons up to these days, maybe they had them in the past as well...

Is it actually a ribbon? Seems more like some sort of fabric lying between the metal part and an actual (missing) ribbon? Try peeking under the other ribbons maybe it's there too.. 🤔

Me as a civilian can say that if you called it a "Military Service Book" then I'd have a pretty good idea what it is. Since it contained personal data, promotions, units served, battle participation and much more it basically covered soldiers entire military career i.e. military service.

Thank you guys! Very informative, much appreciated.

Hi,

in one of my MVK award documents I can read the following:

Krankenvärter der Reserve-Sanitäts-Kompagnie No.1 Sebastian Riedersberger.

Could any of the native German speakers tell me who exactly a "Krankenvärter" was? Google translates it as medical nurse, so do we have a male equivalent of a medical nurse here?

Thanks very much in advance.

On 2/21/2016 at 13:51, dond said:

Here we go.

 

This MVK is the first model (out of 3) in the production of Jacob Leser (a fairly rare piece). The nut holding the swords is either missing or was damaged and sort of repaired at some point in time. There is also a possibility that this cross was initially awarded without swords and they were only added later (Note that this is the only model which was handed out without swords - any other variation from this maker you find without swords got them removed by monkey fingers)

Hello Heiko,

records show he was there since Sept. 1914 till at least June 1916 (that's when he got his MVK). Unfortunately the locations are not readable, I'm pretty sure one of them starts with "Kaisers...." which would point to Koblenz but as far as I know that HQ moved from there already in August...

Thanks.

Hello Gerd,

thanks very much for your reply, much appreciated!

In the meantime I found an article on Wikipedia saying:

Stabswache[Bearbeiten | Quelltext bearbeiten]

Als Ehren- und Schutzwache des Großen Hauptquartiers hatte die Stabswache drei Teile:

• Die Kavalleriestabswache war eine zusammengesetzte Schwadron mit ausnahmslos adeligen Offizieren. Sie diente rein repräsentativen Zwecken.

• Die Infanteriestabswache hatte den Wachtdienst in und um die „Kaiservilla“, vor Hindenburgs Wohnsitz, vor den Unterkünften der „Allerhöchsten“ Besucher und vor demGeneralstabsgebäude.
• Die Artilleriestabswache.......

I think you don't need translation  My original assumption of what the guy did during wartime was pretty accurate as it seems per the Wiki article that Kavallerie's role was mostly representative.

I'd say there's a pretty big chance he met some of the great names like Ludendorf or Hindenburg in person.

Thanks also for the link.

Regards, Viliam.

Hello guys,

yesterday I was researching one of the award certificates in my collection issued to MVK 3rd class. I managed to find the guy on Ancestry, this is where he served:

The award certificate reads: Gefreiter der Kavallerie - Stabswache des Grossen Haupt Quartiers.

Question no. 1 - any idea what his 'job' could have been?  Sounds to me like just standing in front of the door all day long just like today's presidential guards?

During his WW1 service he was awarded two medals - apart of said MVK he received something like "Pr. Kr. Ord. M." which I presume is Prussian Order of the Crown Medal. 

Question no. 2 - what was that Prussian medal usually awarded for?

Thank you very much in advance for your help and sorry if I posted this in wrong category, please feel to move it where appropriate.

Cheers, Viliam.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Bayrische-Ordensspange-Top-Stuck-Original-aus-der-Zeit-sehr-guter-Zustand-/280913818351?pt=Militaria&hash=item4167c4b2ef

...the MVK once had the swords...another up(down)grade...

Hi folks,

I wonder what you can say about this 9-place medal bar which looks like a civilan bar of a medic, a firefighter, a worker, a fighter and who knows what else. I have no intention of buying it, I'm just really curious if this is a legit bar. So what do we have here:

1) Bavarian Ludwig's Cross

2) Prussian Merit Cross

- so far all OK

3) Not sure about this one...is it from Hansa City of Bremen or Hamburg?

4) Honor Cross with Swords - should not be there a version without swords?

5) Prussian Red Cross Medal (3rd class i think)

6) Some Bavarian Red Cross Medal of a local RC association

7) Hungarian Commemorative Medal, again with Swords?

8) Bavarian Firebrigade Honor Cross (2nd class)

9) Bavarian Industry Medal for 25 years (Nazi version)

Is this possible at all? Or just another Frankenstein bar?

Thanks for your thoughts!

Hi, the letters and numbers you usually see on these pieces are hallmarks of makers (letters) and silver content marks (numbers - but you can only find numbers on Mlitary Merit Order not Cross). Common letters are G.H. for Gebruder Hemmerle, WCo for Weiss & Co. or D for Deschler. I have never seen an MVK hallmarked by Jacob Leser, they only marked their MVOs.

New pictures unfortunately does not help me much...it looks good but it's not 100%. As regards the price well that's for sure not a bargain. On eBay these crosses are usually sold between 120-200 EUR, depending on maker, variation and condition. With the enamel damage seen on your pictures i think 150 EUR is really the maximum one should pay for this cross.

Hi, what you posted is an MVK 2nd class with swords and crown by Jacob Leser, their 2nd model in production dated about 1915. In case of this maker it's important to look at the quality of enamel. Jacob Leser was well known for top quality products with state-of-the-art enamel work. From the small pictures I cannot tell if the cross is OK or not. It has some decent enamel and some patina on the silver as well - both are good signs of the cross being authentic but one has to hold it in hand and examine closer to be 100% sure. I can also see some damage to the enamel? which always reduces the price of these pieces (they are fairly common).

I'm thinking when was it last time I saw this type for sale and i recall it was back in 2007. One (original) piece in 5 years = 2800 EUR :)

Well well, I wish one day such piece ends up in my collection. As regards the price...the most current sources state that there were some 180 awards made?I think not more than half of them exist these days.

...and yes, the box itself might be worth some 500-800 EUR.

Indeed,

Without being able to comment on the badges, I think from a practicle point of view, once you have the dies ct, the machine set up and the raw material ready.... it is onlikely that they made things in batches of 10.

I wonder what the minimum produktion run was ?

For non enamel awards maybe a couple of hundred? Then as you get to awards with a lot of hand work (Enamel etc) mabe the same, but with less of them being "finished", more "stored parts" which could be finished as needed?

Best

Chris

Good point Chris. But remember that in case of Jacob Leser the swords were only attached with bolt and nut. Only thing you need to do is to unscrew them and you have a perfect non combattant cross without any traces of swords being ever there. Sometimes the swords leave a traces of oxidation on the cross, these are however not visible on the one pictured.

My point with the early production types was that crosses without swords were only made up to 1915. At that time Leser produced their first model with different medallion and hinge. I cannot show an example of an early production as I'm far far away from my collection at the moment. Cross that we can see on the pictures above is the latest production made roughly from mid 1915 onwards.

Hello, hmmm...strange piece. Godet used to produce crosses with both medallion enameled, but this one looks like home-enameled (or at least repaired).

Hello, my understanding was that crosses without swords by Leser should only be early types. These early types had different medallion on the back and different hinge. But that's only how I see that.

Unfortunately I don't have any example and I doubt anyone here does...remember the number of awards :(

Thank you very much. Do you also know the period of the production of this type?

I think Weiss did them throughout entire war. At the end there was a slightly different version produced with the belt buckle fully enameled.