Dolf

Welcome to the #1 site on Mongolian awards! Good to see you here!!

What we have, to date, on the SB:

(A 20a/M 4.1) -- Type 1 (screwback ? ~1000 awarded); Low = 158 /High = 788; 1945-71

(A 20b/M 4.2) -- Type 2.1 (pinback - ~700 awarded); Low = 835/High = 2006; 1971-2002

Type 2.2 (unnumbered, coarse manufacture); 2002?

Is there an intermediate form between the last two?? Nasty low quality but numbered? Parallel to other orders??

Ed,

Not all the S-B type 2.2 are unnumbered. But I can't obviously guarantee that those numbered I've seen wasn't "home made" by some dealers...

I know these are currently awarded in Mongolia, have read it in Mongolian online news, so those issued are logically most certainly officially numbered.

Dolf

PS: Email(s) sent...

Heres my pin Back Ser #1947

Hi Ron,

Welcome to this Forum

Nice S/N you have there, looks like a date... if you see what I mean. Like my pinback (#2006), still the highest S/N I've seen so far. The screwback has a much lower S/N, 185...

Best wishes,

Dolf

Rick,

Anyway, as you ask for one with the Khalkhin Gol Medal ribbon on it, here is one for you to enjoy

The fist ribbon on the top left of this ribbon bar: Red/Yellow/Red

Dolf

A point to consider...... among all of these Mongolian Ribbon Bar Groups there is not a single Halhingol for 1939!!!!!!!!!!! Hmmmmmmmm!

(I wish I could claim for this observation, but it was the Evil One who noticed!!)

Rick,

Ribbons for the Khalkhin Gol Medal are very hard to find!

Maybe they are not seen on these ribbon bars because these ribbons for the Khalkhin Gol Medal only exist since 1966 (when the Badge became a Medal) and maybe these ribbon bars are older than that! I don't know, just a guess!

Dolf

And another with 14 ribbons, including one for the Order of Sukhebaatar, Order of Combat Valor, 2 Order of Polar Star, and again quite a few Medals, among them one Soviet, for the Medal Victory over Japan.

Dolf

Ok, the two bigger ribbon bars I have.

One with 18 ribbons, among them for the Order of Combat Valor, 3 Order of Polar Star, Order of Red Banner of Combat Valor, then a lot of Medals, including two Soviet ones, for the Medal Victory over Japan and Victory over Germany.

Dolf

Hi Christer,

Welcome aboard. Small World...

Nice to see your ribbon bars here, now I'll have to post mine too

Rick,

Christer still left a few for me I guess And there are still a few more out there that show up from time to time.

Cheers

Dolf

I agree. They deserve more than this.

Cheers.

Ch.

I guess the reason is indeed what Chris mentions on his post:

The problem with these is there are more of them than the market needs.

For my Portuguese War Cross 1814-1918 ( pics here, posts #7 and #8: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=5643 ) I paid 95.00GBP (around 135.00 Euros) less than a year ago! But these are as far as I know much rarer than the French ones.

I guess it's the same as for the Interallied Victory Medals. Most are sold for very reasonable prices, but a few rarer ones are much more expensive and much harder to find!

Thanks again guys,

Dolf

I've recently bought one in the "Puces de Vanves" for 7 euros (and there were many of them available), and as recently as today, I've found many (around 10) of them for sale for 10 euros each (before any negotiation) in the Chatou Foire (a kind of brocante lasting a week).

Ch.

Thanks again Christophe.

I checked eBay France as suggested by g_deploige and indeed there are quite a few offered for much less than the 45 Euros this guy asked for the piece I posted!

I guess it could be possible to get one there for 5 - 10 Euros, and in better condition than the one I posted!

Cheers,

Dolf

EUR10 ? At a militaria shop?

I have seen them for those prices at Brocants, but what would a realistic dealer price be? They seem to range between EUR25 - 35 ?

Chris,

Apparently, according to g_deploige these sell for 2,50 - 15 Euros on eBay.

As for Christophe I don't know where they can sell in Paris for the price he mentions, 5 - 10 Euros. Let's wait for his reply.

Anyway this one here (Lisbon) wasn't for sale in a Militaria Shop or from a Medal's dealer, this guy sells a bit of everything (postcards, old books, old collectible cards, a few Medals from time to time) in a local weekly Collector's kind of fair. Well, at least 95%+ of the fair is mainly for coins and bank notes collectors in fact, so call it Collector's fair is a big name for what it really is, but that's how they call it

Cheers,

Dolf

Dolf,

PS : Maybe an optical effect, but I still think yours has not the "normal" size.

Christophe,

I missed your PS before I guess

Anyway, any idea of the size of a "normal" one and of a miniature? Next time I'll see the guy I could try to measure this one just to confirm that.

Thanks again,

Dolf

Once again thank you very much guys!

Dolf

It is a the French War Cross

there are crosses with the date 1914-1915 , 1914-1916, 1914-1917, 1914-1918

see ols the page from France Phaleristique (in french)

There is olso a book about it see http://cgi.ebay.fr/CROIX-DE-GUERRE-VALEUR-...1QQcmdZViewItem

Thanks a lot.

French is no problem

Dolf

Christophe,

Merci!

I don't think it's a miniature; I don't have it with me for measuring it correctly but I saw it this morning and it's the normal size of a normal Medal.

5-7 Euros!!! The guy was asking 45 Euros for it!!!... Glad I didn't buy it!

Thanks again.

Cheers

Dolf

Same, reverse and reverse closeup:

Dolf

Gentlemen,

Can anyone please help to identify this Medal?

I know it's French, I know it's from WWI 1914-1918, and that's it. But that is obvious of course

What I'd like to know is it's right name and the average price.

Thanks a lot in advance,

Dolf

Obverse, and obverse closeup:

Yet, unlike most of the tiny provincial badges, this one is a whopping 50 mm. No way to tell that from my earlier scan, I guess. I don't see that scale at the provincial level.

For comparison (against a ready-at-hand companion):

Ed,

All I was able to find about your Badge is that it's most probably a Military School Badge.

Dolf

And finally a detail of the ring on mine posted above.

Can you see the differences?

Dolf

Another piece, and again some differences on the same details mentioned before.

Honestely I can't guarantee it, but I suppose this one could be of the same period as mine (maybe the more recent type of all those posted here), only made by a different manufacturer, I guess.

Dolf

Ok, so here are a few examples of what I meant.

These differences are of some help to date the pieces, but anyway, as they can be made by different jewllers I guess each one has it's own "signature" and some details might be different because of this.

Example 1, the piece that I believe would be the older one from all these posted here.

Notice the differences on the way the enamel is applied, if comparing with mine posted above. Notice also the ring on this one. And also some final details on the manufacture. This one is most probably from the early days of the Republic, around 1910.

Dolf

That's a nice Benedict of Avis. Old piece? These simple elegant pieces are really nice.

Ed,

Thank you.

It's already sometimes hard to know exactly from which year date many of our Soviet and Mongolian serial numbered pieces, as we both know, so I guess you can imagine how hard it can be to establish how old a not numbered piece can be! And with the frustrating lack of references, this can only be a guess!

My guess is that this Order of Avis is not too old, but my guess is only based on pics and other pieces I can compare, and some details of the manufacture, such as the ring on the top of the Medal that secures it to the small loop on the base of the larger loop where the ribbon is attached. Sorry if it seems a bit confuse Other details of the manufacturing process also have influence on my guess, such as the enamel.

Anyway, I suppose it could be from somewhere between the late 70's and the 90's, last century.

I'll post pics of another piece that apparently should be older than this one, so it might help to illustrate my guesses mentioned above.

Dolf

Paul,

The last award to the right is indeed a Order of Christ.

As far as I know the only Portuguese Order that has Classes is the one for Agriculture, Commerce and Industry Merit. All the others, including of course the Order of Christ, have Grades: Knight, Officer, Commander, Grand-Officer, Grand-Cross.

I can't see your piece clearly enough to find out which Grade it is! Also I'm not used to see these as part of Medal bars and I guess I wouldn't be able to determine the Grade anyway, sorry

It's much easier when I see a Medal alone, as the Grade is determined by the kind of rosette on the ribbon, see what I mean?

Finally, I will try to do some research, but in theory your Order seems to be of the Model adopted by the Republic, established in 1910, so a post 1910 piece!

Hope it helps,

Dolf

This one is very nice, although I have no idea what it is

Jan,

My guess is that it could be one of those Province Badges, in this case one for the Sukhbaatar Province.

Dolf

And a closeup of the obverse:

Dolf

Reverse:

Dolf