kees

Thank you gentlemen.

If ever you might find an 'Urkunde' for these medals or one of the colonial medals for one of the local members of the 'Schutztruppen' I would be very obliged if you would upload this to Zeno or send a scan to info@ptbvhrokerspartij.nl

Best wishes on your hunts for medals,

Kees

QUOTE (pinpon590 @ May 21 2008, 14:07 ) One question again : it's really impossible to differentiate a "Preussische KVM" and a "Deutsche KVM, 2nd class silver medal" ???

Second question : how differentiate a KVM "Kriegs-Verdienst" and a MEZ 2 ???? (size ? metal ?)

First question: as I understand it - no.

Second question: they are different in size (25 mm vs. 40 mm)

Pictures of the German Kriegerverdientsmedaille 1st class gold (silver gild) and 1st class in silver (for the 2nd class in gold and silver see Wild Cards pic):

Dear Gentlemen,

I take care of the German Colonial category in website for oriental numismatic website Zeno.ru, http://www.zeno.ru/showgallery.php?cat=7136

As medals are within the spfere of interrest of numismatics I also like to present medals relevant to these colonies.

As you have shown here nice specimens of the Krieger Verdienst medal, I would like to ask your kind permission to show these in Zeno. Reference and mention of copyright will be given as I have done with other items in this category.

As I can’t find in this website a way to send you a personal message or email,I will take the liberty to asume you agree unless you react negative to this request. You can also react directly by putting a comment to a picture of yours which I might put in Zeno. The picture will then be removed as soon as possible.

To give something in return I suggest you follow this link to an off-strike of the Krieger Verdienst 1 class http://www.zeno.ru/showphoto.php?photo=75865

Please feel welcome to add to my work in Zeno by uploading interesting pieces and giving comments, registration is free.

Gratefully yours,

Kees Uitenbroek

Amsterdam

That must be specified in the A.K.O. of 12 June 1912 creating this medal.

Given the delays in processing claims-- most of which were from many years if not decades earlier, and the outbreak of the World War (when I suspect that awards processing simply ceased since I have never sen any Urkunden after the war started)...

I would venture that virtually none of the "native" issues ever reached Africa and remained in Germany, unissued.

Has anybody got acces to the A.K.O. of 12 june 1912 ? Where could it be found ?

Dear Gentlemen,

I am managing the German Colonies section on the oriental numismatic website zeno.ru http://www.zeno.ru/showgallery.php?cat=7136

As medals are related to numismatics I am trying to find pictures of medals related to

German colonies.

Of course I like to show original ones. That’s where I need your help.

Searching for these particular Southwest Africa ones, every time I find one on internet, it is different from the ones before.

These medals come for combatants and non-combatants. First one bronze, Suedwest Afrika 1904–06, Den siegreichen Streitern. Second steel, Suedwest Afrika 1904–06, Verdienst um die Expedition. See http://www.traditionsverband.de/schutztruppe/sw_afrika.html

I think the right pictures there show an original and the left ones not.

Reason for this I find in http://www.omsa.org/forums/showthread.php?t=875 post 8.

There is stated that originals will have the name of the engraver Schultz where the shoulder is cut. Private re-strikes would not show this name there. Note that the picture in post 2 is the same as in traditionsverband.de. No Schultz figures on the shoulder. More minor differences are visible, for example in 1904-06. As original medals of both kinds would have been struck with the same 1904-06 die, this one doesn’t seem to be original.

Schultz on shoulder doesn’t seem to be a guaranty, see http://www.derrittmeister.com/productpages/051392.htm different 1904-06

Maybe http://www.zeno.ru/showphoto.php?photo=75465 currently on auction at Meister & Sonntag http://www.ams-stuttgart.de might be an original candidate, but picture is not clear enough at shoulder.

http://www.omsa.org/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2827&size=big&cat= ‘s picture is just a little bit to small to say more.

Some others ?:

http://www.grafficserver.de/cgi-bin/889/vio.matrix?kd=c9f667ec5402c53&el=2488&typ=popup

http://www.dhm.de/magazine/orden/abbs/094.htm

Could any of you tell me what to look for, or even better, supply me with a good pictures of the real thing?

My understanding is the smaller ones were issued to native troops while the normal size were issues to white troops. The native issue is somewhat scarcer.

Paul

Thank you Paul.

Would you know any "official" source for this?

Kees

Westfalische Auktions Gesellschaft, auction 51, september 2009, contained 2 colonial campaign madels: http://www.wag-aukti....de/auktion-en/ click top left „online catalog", click Auktion 51, click Medaillen, click Kolonien, scroll lots 2491 & 2492.

The two medals, with text „Den tapferen Streitern für Deutschlands Ehre", differ only in size.

Lot 2491 ( http://www.grafficse...=2494&typ=popup ) is 27,8 mm and is described as being for coloured. Reference given Slg. Grönegreß 1235, Hüsken 11.11 a.

Lot 2492 ( http://www.grafficse...=2495&typ=popup ) is 32,5 mm and is described as being for whites, Reference given Slg. Grönegreß -, Hüsken 11.10 a.

My question is if these two different sizes do indeed indicate difference of race of the receiver or if there is some other reason why they differ in size.