When Ribbon Bars LIE

[Guest Rick Research]

We are all used to Bad Bars made by Bad People these days to trick and deceive Careless Buyers...

but what about Bad Bars that were made Way Back When by careless military effects outfitters and worn by the original libving recipients?

Here is one-- and odd duck that went from Heiko's house, to the new owner of the Trenkler group

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=5021&hl=Trenkler

to come live at my house ... and after some months of digging and hunting and tying down ALL possible Other Explanations the answer is--

the outfitter GOOFED in 1934/35:

The use of a Saxon longservice ribbon to duplicate the Italian Messina Earthquake Medal of 1908 is quite common, so that's not it.

Spot the Hideous Error?

It's not the jumbled precedence-- rather typical of retired old boys not really paying attention as Imperial Rules that had lapsed under Weimar were being re-shuffled buy the new Thousand Year Reich.

Nope, not the Red eagle Order that shgould be behindthe Hindenburg Cross.

It's Ribbon Number 3.

What's that!? you cry. What's the "problem" with what is CLEARLY, unmistakably, can't be anything else here BUT a W?rttemberg Friedrich Order-Knight 1st Class with Swords (WF3aX)??????

Well, it isn't.

It's a peacetime Prussiaan Crown Order 4th Class that the outfitter has mistakenly placed Xs on, almost 75 years ago.

And man oh man did THAT screw up an accurate identification!!!!! :speechless1:

[Guest Rick Research]

The keys here ARE that close enough nobody will notice Earthquake ribbon AND the China 1900/02 Medal. Combined with a Red Eagle 4:

the officers aboard the two German warships that assisted at Messina are known, and all-- including a couple of Marines on loan from the army, can be tracked down and eliminated as suspects--

they either joined AFTER 22.03.97 (no Centenary Medal) or had other awards combinations.

That leaves exactly ONE person, whose identity was concealed by this error:

Marine Chefingenieur (= Fregattenkapit?n) aD Elimar Steinbr?gge

Born 10 October 1867

Imperial German Navy 02.10.1884- 24.11.1919

Obermaschinist 01.04.98

Marine Ingenieur

Marine Oberingenieur 21.03.05

Marine Stabsingenieur 27.03.09

Marine Oberstabsingenieur 22.03.14

Marine Chefingenieur 23.05.18

1900: Deckoffiziereschule AND received ?Allerh?chste Bel?bigung:? 24.10.00 while on heavy cruiser SMS ?F?rst Bismarck? IN CHINA

1905: on SMS ?Brandenburg?

1908: on SMS ?Hertha? which took part in MESSINA EARTHQUAKE relief

1909: on SMS ?Pelikan?

1910: Leading Engineer on SMS ?Preu?en?

1914/wartime: Leading Engineer SMS "Ostfriesland? to October 1915, zV I. Werft Division to February 1916, then Machine-Technical Advisor (Beirat) at Kiel Dockyard and on staff of the Director of the Equipment Testing Facility (Ressort) to September 1917. Finally, from then until end of the war, Chief Engineer of the Mediterranean Division.

Member of the M.O.V.?Nr. 3517. In 1928 Teacher at Technisch Staatslehranstalt, Bremen. Same 1931. Not listed in 1935 or 1937 MOV directories. 1938 MIV Directory listed his widow, E. living in Bremen 11, Osterdeich 177a.

There is NO other match possible. The Prussian Crown Order has WRONGLY been fitted with crossed swords device by the ribbon bar outfitter?who should have placed both Orders AFTER the Hindenburg Cross X anyway.