"Standardisation" of Police Uniforms & Vehicles

[leigh kitchen]

A link to this discussion relating to EU police uniform changes:

http://uotw.heavenforum.com/uniforms-of-eu...europe-t308.htm

Having worked as part of a multi-national police organisation I thought that there should have been a standardisation simply in the form of a common insignia within the mission concerned, one that would be easily understood by the local population.

Police officers from numerous nations wore numerous variations on uniform - various shades of camouflage, combinations of greens, yellows, shades of blue, green, khaki, grey, brown.

Certainly to the British many would look like soldiers rather than police officers, but then some were more soldier than police officer in British terms.

Name badges & national flag insignia would be worn, but although there was a common insignia it was'nt one that stood out & although it was issued to certain nationalities, it was'nt to others, a very optional private purchase item.

Personally I don't particularly favour the enforced adoption by EU edict of an EU wide standard colour of uniforms & vehicles etc.

What I would like to see within Britain is the standardisation not of traditional little items like buttons & collar dogs etc but of a modern uniform that clearly distinguishes the police officer from personnel such as security officers & Police Community Support Officers simply because the latter are not police officers - they don't have the training, legal powers etc of "real" police officers.

Things have come to a pretty pass when we have the common occurence of people who are misbehaving having to ask "Are you a real police officer?" so they know how far they can push things & if they can be arrested by the police.

And I'd like to see a certain level of standardisation within Britain of police vehicles - simply that "marked" vehicles are all the same colour & have certain common aspects of livery.

The constabulary covering the area where I live use white, silver, dark blue, black & yellow vehicles in liveries that don't stand out from security firms, highways or road workers.

Standardise the things so that the public know who is who.

Edited May 28, 2009 by leigh kitchen

[leigh kitchen]

An article from "The Guardian" June 2007:

Berlin's police department has been forced to accept parcels of 30-year-old second-hand uniforms donated by colleagues around the country because the German capital is so strapped for cash.

While in most parts of Germany the police are discarding their old-fashioned khaki green uniforms in favour of a new and smarter navy blue design, bankrupt Berlin has insisted that its officers continue wearing the old attire.

The city's police chief, Dieter Glietsch, sent an urgent memorandum to richer states, saying that Berlin's police would "gratefully receive new or used uniforms, because there are as yet no plans introduce the new blue uniform in Berlin". He assured his colleagues that Berlin would pick up the postage costs. In response, uniforms for male and female officers have been arriving from all over the country.

The move from khaki green to blue uniforms started in Germany two years ago, after an EU initiative to help the police build a more unified image across the continent, although there was no EU directive on this. The change was favoured in Germany because the khaki is said to too closely resemble army dress, and blue is seen as softer and more friendly.

Bodo Pfalzgraf, head of the police trade union, told the tabloid Bild that being the recipient of hand-me-downs was making Berlin's officers feel second-class. "The green-beige uniforms are 30 years old and no longer up to the European standard," he complained.

[Mike Dwyer]

Leigh,

Interesting thoughts. I, for one, looking at this from an American perspective, am not a big fan of standardization. As I'm sure you're aware, here in the US we have all kinds of uniforms, different colors, different syles, etc. The key here is to look for the word POLICE on the uniform or patrol car somewhere, and usually if you see a pistol, then they're police. There is such a thing as an armed security officer, but normally their shoulder patch will say SECURITY as opposed to police. Blue is a very popular color for police here in the US, but you also see other colors too. Here in the state of Florida, by state law the mandated colors for sheriffs is green, so normally sheriff's deputies are wearing dark green, although some counties wear grey with green epaulettes. The county I live in wears all dark green, but some wear white shirts, or grey shirts, and at least one used to wear a very pale green shirt. All of the city police forces in my county wear some type of blue uniform. The state troopers wear tan trimmed in black.

In the scenario you mentioned about working in a multi-national situation, I can fully agree with some type of standardization, but I'm not sure it needs to be carried from country to country on a normal everyday basis.

No offense to any of our German friends, but I always thought of the green and beige uniform as being utterly horrible! I lived in Berlin from 1964-1965 and back then the Berlin police wore a very 1940's grey uniform that, to me, represented what a German police officer was supposed to look like. In the winter they even wore the long, double-breasted grey overcoats. I'm sure those uniforms were phased out for being too German looking (as in Second or Third Reich), but they looked sharp. There was one particular section of the Berlin police back then that still wore the old police shako and riding boots. I've seen the new blue German uniform and while it might be a slight improvement over the green and beige one, I'm not turning cartwheels of joy over it either.

Just my two cents worth, as we say here, which won't have any effect on European police uniforms. I mean if they left it up to me, the German police would still be wearing pickelhaubes! :rolleyes:

[Mervyn Mitton]

Mike - I'm going to join-in, because I fully agree with you - for once, I can't follow Leigh on standardisation. Yes - standardise weapons, radios - even vehicles- that helps recognition, but not uniform. The British uniform evolved from the 1829 pattern and changed to it's present form of tunic and helmet in the 1860's. People all over the World immediately recognise our Police - and indeed most other Countries uniforms are also recognised on sight. I agree that changes have to be made to keep up with modern standards - for example, my winter greatcoat was so heavy that I could hardly walk - let alone run ! So, make changes but, keep it recognisable.

PICTURE : THE FIRST METROPOLITAN POLICE OFFICER IN 1829

(Drawing by Bob Marrion - our plan drawer at 'H' Div. and a brilliant artist.)

Edited May 28, 2009 by Mervyn Mitton

[leigh kitchen]

Leigh,

...... I mean if they left it up to me, the German police would still be wearing pickelhaubes!

You're thinking of a handy source for spare parts?

Ironic that the Germans are'nt but that the British & others are still wearing versions of the pikelhaube.

A photo of three police officers who were part of the UN IPTF in Bosnia (British, Indonesian & Indian),all fulfilling the same roll within the same organisation, but to the poor old local civilian on the street who can't read or speak English (& as happened, mistook say Malaysian flag patches for US flag patches, when these & a few more exotic uniforms are involved there's nothing really to indicate "police" rather than military.

Not the best photo to show the colourful combinations of uniforms that were possible, but one that was to hand.

Some nations do have uniforms distinct from their norm for their police officers to wear in such organisations in order to meet the local public perception of a police uniform, eg the Jordanians wore khaki but were also issued dark blue with light blue shirts for the wear in the IPTF (I may be wrong with that example).

I just feel that in the multi-national units there should be a clear means of identifying "police" as opposed to say, army - an obvious badge worn by all would do.

Within Britain I'd like to see a clear & obvious disticton between police & "others". The public should know who they're dealing with.

[leigh kitchen]

Mike - I'm going to join-in, because I fully agree with you - for once, I can't follow Leigh on standardisation. Yes - standardise weapons, radios - even vehicles- that helps recognition, but not uniform. The British uniform evolved from the 1829 pattern and changed to it's present form of tunic and helmet in the 1860's. People all over the World immediately recognise our Police - and indeed most other Countries uniforms are also recognised on sight. I agree that changes have to be made to keep up with modern standards - for example, my winter greatcoat was so heavy that I could hardly walk - let alone run ! So, make changes but, keep it recognisable.

PICTURE : THE FIRST METROPOLITAN POLICE OFFICER IN 1829

(Drawing by Bob Marrion - our plan drawer at 'H' Div. and a brilliant artist.)

I'm not in favour of standardising so much Merv, merely a few things - the colour of police vehicles in Britain for example, there are goodness knows how many different types of vehicles in use through the various forces in Britain, I have no views aganst that, just the fact that they're in umpteen different colours & the go fast stripes & baboons backside livery etc varies so drastically from force to force or within force. Securty companies sometimes use insignia based on the police crown above star, only the wording & a central design differing.

It's hard to tell security guard etc from police, there's only the lack of a blue light amongst the reds, ambers & whites of a bar on the roof to tell them apart.

When I talk of standardisation of the uniform I'm talking of the uniform as it is now, not the uniform as was, not making all the tunics & insignia the same for example - they've gone.

The uniforms in Britain have completely changed in recent years, it's not a case of a force losing a tradition of a badge on the shoulderstrap or use of a particular shade of blue for the uniform or something like that.

When it comes to the uniforms in Britain, the only thing in use nowadays that is recognisable from the old uniform are the helmet & boots.

Generally, tunics, whistles, white gloves & all aspects of old uniform are not issued any more.

Neighbouring county forces differed in that one would have blue fleeces, another black, the diced bands would be different or non-existent, there was no history or tradition involved here & now there is less so, as forces have moved through the short anorak, fleece, NATO "woolly pully" phase into a normal garb of yellow fluorescent blouson, body armour, black polo shirt & combat pants with bat belts & batons.

There are variations on this, but I'm basing my suggestion of standardisation on what is currently worn & the fact that it's so similar to uniform worn by non-police organisations, I'm not saying sweep away the old, it's gone already.

Where's the objection to police forces wearing the same yellow fluorescents with the same reflective stripes or dicing, the same coloured polo shirts, the same black combat pants & the like, when they're wearing these garments already?

These paramilitary looking uniforms are the norm here, they don't display much in the way of tradition, so make 'em all the same with the odd badge or foible to hopefully carry on tradition.

And if they're going to ditch the helmet for a baseball cap, god help me, let's all have the same baseball caps (but if they've got chequered bands let the City of London have a red one instead of blue).

[Mervyn Mitton]

Now - I fully agree with you !! I hadn't realised that the uniform had already, changed so drastically. When I last visited the flat, it was Sept. 2007 and in the whole month I was there, I only saw ONE uniformed officer. We mustn't try to live in the past - however, it is sad that so much is changing - often , for the sake of change.

[leigh kitchen]

The helmet is really about the only thing left. When I had to wear it I hated the thing & was'nt impressed by the calls to keep it that came from senior ranks & retired policemen who did'nt have to wear it anymore, but now I don't have to wear it & no longer get those headaches & pains in the neck - guess what? I've changed my mind.

Cambridgeshire has recently dropped button up white shirts for shiny black boil in the bag polo shirts that are flammable (dark blue for PCSO's), so that's a retrograde step considering they ditched the old drip - dry nylon shirts & started on the flame retardent path 30 years ago.

But then, at least your legs should be ok, 'cos they're still clad in heavy flame retardent wool based combat pants.

I think their black body armour & yellow fluorescent blousons are now changing to yellow fluoerescent body armour & longer yellow fluoro jackets.

The kit changes constantly it seems, the one constant seems to be that it should make you sweat.

[Mike Dwyer]

Leigh,

I'm fully with you that standardized uniforms are necessary on a multi-national assignment like the photo you showed. I would be thoroughly confused in that situation.

[Mervyn Mitton]

Leigh - I agree with you about the helmet being awkward and heavy - but no way could they get it away from me ! I was asked to consider C.I.D. - no way, I was proud to be a foot P.C.

I think I have mentioned this in previous posts - all police officers are warrant officers - in the sense that they hold The Queen's (or King's) Warrant , to perform their duties. This goes back hundreds of years to when all power was authorised by the Monarch. My Warrant number was 158,277 meaning that I was that number of officers since the first one marched out of New Scotland Yard in 1829 !! That is history in the truest meaning. I wonder what number they are up to now ?