Socialist Hungarian Order of Labor - Question

gjw · July 20

Hey all, my Hungarian P.R collecting focus is military and uniformed/security services, but I have a question on the Order of Labor.

I have seen photos of military personnel wearing this order, but was wondering if it was common to award this to military/security personnel?

Stay well my friends

Greg

Philip.S · July 21

Greg,

Good question! I can't give you a completely correct answer, but I will provide you with my best speculations!

Of course, members of part time security organisations, like the workers militia, would, of course, receive the award duly as corresponds to their "day job". Members of the police, or armed forces, I'm really not sure on. It's a possibility that they earned the award before joining, or after leaving, their relative armed forces or security organisations. I can also, well imagine, that members of those organisations with more or less a desk job, may have received the award, however you'd have to confirm that with someone else! In general, I doubt that the award was given to serving members of the armed forces, or security organisations, often, if at all.

I hope you find my thoughts interesting,

Regards,

Philip.S

gjw · July 21

Thanks Phil, good analysis. A lot of what you said makes sense.

Stay well my friend

Greg

Megan · July 22

One could surmise that military personnel involved in procurement of equipment might become eligible in the course of their work with manufacturers, too.

steveBobby · July 22

Greeting Greg

Generally speaking, based on the experience of the Soviet Union and some other European socialist countries, police, national security personnel, and technical personnel in the army can all receive the Labor order or the Labor Red Banner order representing civilian merit. I believe that at the very beginning, when the Hungarian government established the Order of Labor in 1948, these military personnel should have been able to be linked to it. But what is very strange is that this phenomenon did not continue during the Raksi government or even the later Kadar government. It is clear that the subsequent Hungarian Communist government paid more attention to the distinction between civilian and military awards. Most of the medals or orders that police, state security personnel and military technicians can receive are still military awards.But this does not deny the possibility of military personnel receiving the Labor Medal. For example, we can still see some officers or generals wearing the Labor Medal in photos from the 1950s. (I will list a photo of Janza Károly a lieutenant general of the Hungarian People's Army).

By the way，I think the idea of the workers' militia mentioned by my colleague Philip.S is correct. Paramilitary organizations, which are between civilian and military, can indeed straddle the line between two different reward classes.This is reflected in the photos, where we can see that many of the award-winning photos of the Workers’ Militia have the shadow of the Labor order.

But in any case, this is just my own speculation. We may need more photos of actual examples or more identity information of the recipients to confirm whether our hypothesis is correct.

Yours

Steve

gjw · July 22

Great info Steve....very much appreciated!

I'm learning from you old hands, can't thank you folks enough.

Stay well

Greg

Philip.S · July 22

Steve,

Many thanks for your answer, it's most informative, however, as befits the red banner of labour, would I be right in saying there were both military and civilian versions? I have none to show or give proof, but I have it in my head that the military version had the Hungarian national colours in triangles along the border of the flag, whereas the civilian one was plain. Do I have the right idea?😁

Also, it's nice to see the first variation of the order of labour in your first Image!

Regards,

Philip.S

Megan · July 23

I don't know of a distinction between civilian and military awards, but the design changed: early versions (1946-1956) had a red/green/white triangle edging to the red flag, later awards did not - the flag being plain red.

Here's the early version for you:

steveBobby · July 23

16 hours ago, Philip.S said:

Steve,

Many thanks for your answer, it's most informative, however, as befits the red banner of labour, would I be right in saying there were both military and civilian versions? I have none to show or give proof, but I have it in my head that the military version had the Hungarian national colours in triangles along the border of the flag, whereas the civilian one was plain. Do I have the right idea?😁

Also, it's nice to see the first variation of the order of labour in your first Image!

Regards,

Philip.S

Of course Philip.S, the Hungarians did design it this way. In the original 1953 proposal, they used a circular shape, from this point on, this design was used.Then in 1955, they updated their design again. Since then, only the national emblem has been changed.

IN 1953：