Bilco

HI Gents, A site operated by the US Navy has a page covering the Navy clasps to the US vics, including a list of the names of every ship and the clasp its crew members were entitled to: http://www.history.navy.mil/medals/ww1vic.htm Bill

Hi Gents, There are several Italian sites that deal with the vics in general as well as their own: http://www.faleristica.it/collezione.php?id=5 A general page on the vics - if you click on the photos on the right-hand side another pane opens. http://miles.forumcommunity.net/?t=9288433 A forum dealing with all the vics ... http://miles.forumcommunity.net/?t=49110969 ... and a thread about Italian vics. http://www.iagiforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=4767 Another forum dealing with all the vics. I use Google Translate to get them into my language of choice. Bill

Hi Rick, You have been busy! It's all looking good - I must look out a few more web site links. I guess if we want to link to dicussions in other areas of GMIC they go in the appropriate country thread here. Bill

Hi Rick, I noticed that you have started a new thread - WW1 South African Vic Medals Info - and I'm wondering if this might lead to confusion with the existing South African Victory Medal thread. It might result in future postings being split between the two unnecessarily. Maybe your post in the new thread could just as fruitfully go in the existing one instead? Bill

Final tranche: .... and the suspension - looks more like a filed-down ball to me: Bill

Next tranch: Bill

Hi Gents, First tranche of the countries' names from the reverse: Bill

Hi Gents, The close-ups of the Unofficial Type 3 with wire suspension, as promised. Obverse ... Reverse ... and close-up of the 'Great War for Civilisation' lettering on the reverse. Compared with the cylinder type in post #105 - the upper and lower limbs of the E in the first word are touching the shaft of the axe, as is the lower right angle of the Z at the bottom. Bill

Hi Rick, I know that you have been Moderator of this section for a little while, so first off - sorry for not having acknowledged you earlier. We are lucky to have this section in this form, thanks to the work of Tim B. When I first joined GMIC looking for information of the WW1 vics there was just one very long thread - now locked and pinned at 37 pages. There is lots of good information there, but it's hard work to pick through it - I've been through all 37 pages several times! Maybe there is a way to extract it into threads for individual counties, but I think it would be a full-time occupation. I just noticed today that, at the bottom of this section, there is a link to a thread about the Belgian vics in the Belgium section. If that is your work, thank you - I hadn't seen it before. I see that there is a similar thread in the United States section - http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/25519-ww1-victory-medal/page-1 -so maybe a link to that would be good, and maybe there are other threads in other countries' sections - France for example. Talking of links - is there any mileage in having a thread with links to other web sites with information about the WW1 vics? There is a French site - http://www.medailles1914-1918.fr/lesallies-medail.html - with sections for all the Allies. I expect most people here have favourite web sites like this - if there was a dedicated thread we could post the links. It would not need any chat, just the name and link, and a note of whether it's vics in general or for one country. Just a few random thoughts, but I hope there is something useful in there! Bill

Hi Gents, As promised, the close-ups - No O SPANIEL on the obverse. On the reverse the letters between the 2 and 4 o'clock seem quite sharp and well formed, but they get much less sharp away from that quadrant. Similarly, the leaves on the right side seem sharp but on the left they have marks suggesting some movement of the die. The lion in the central shield looks sharp. There is also an odd 'shadow' effect behind the banner with 1914. And the LA maker's marks - On the obverse ... ... and on the reverse. All comments welcome. Bill

Hi Gents, Just in today - Romania Unofficial Type 3, with C instead of G, and wire suspension: It seems to be quite nicely struck, although the suspension looks more like a filed-down ball - I'll do close-ups and details of the countries names in the next couple of days. All comments welcome. Bill

Hi Gents, This is my latest acquisition - I was lucky enough to snag this Czech Official Type 1 It has nice, sharp though tiny LA maker's marks - in the space between Victory's wing, hand, laurel branch and helmet on the obverse, and at the 3 o'clock, in the vee at the end of the banner with 1919, on the reverse. Although the obverse is cleanly struck, there are signs of double-striking or die movement on the reverse. I'll try to get clear close-ups over the weekend. All comments welcome, Bill

Hi Gents, An interesting discussion on the wire-ring suspension US vics, with authoritative input from Johnnymac on the US MIlitaria Forum - http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/167263-rare-wwi-victory-medal-w-ring-top-some-information-questions/page__hl__%2Bww1+%2Bvictory+%2Bmedal Bill

Hi Oliver, An interesting factoid about the Chobillon mark. I found this item http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/35605-belgium-medal/page-2 post #39 with examples of the Chobillon mark, and it is said that the AC triangular mark is only found on the Victory medals. Bill

Hi Oliver, Malheureusement pas - at least, I haven't seen one. Maybe someone here has one??? Bill

Hi Oliver, A very nice example, and a very clear Janvier-Berchot triangle mark. Laslo only mentions the Chobillon-made version, I see. Mine is the same as yours. Bill

Hi Martin, Wot, no Siam! There is a very good copy of the Siam vic on eBay US http://www.ebay.com/itm/b0070-World-War-I-Victory-medal-for-Siam-Thailand-/350569677917?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item519f94c45d The seller is NCHS - National Capital Historical SAles, which I believe is based in Vietnam. This is a well-known fake. The colour of the items you posted about is a give-away - but someone will try to age them and pass them off as kosher. Bill

Hi Martin, Yes, that's the one. I suppose that these could be faked quite easily from a standard Offical Type 1 by buffing the exergue down to remove the maker's and designer's names. See posts# 25 and 30 on page 2 of this thread. Bill

Hi Martin, There is a photo of the Reissue Type 1 compared with the Official Type here http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/17245-ww1-victory-medals-of-the-world/page-31#entry442716 post # 618. That gives some idea of the colour. The Type 2 reissue is certainly collectible - was the eBay one from the same seller as the odd Belgian that Jim flagged up? There is a photo here http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/17245-ww1-victory-medals-of-the-world/page-5#entry365405 post # 81. There is a photo of the Repro Type 3 here http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/17245-ww1-victory-medals-of-the-world/page-16#entry385690 post# 303. I haven't seen the cast copies - Laslo's book 2nd edition came out in 1992, but it was first published in 1973, so these cast copies are quite old. There are usually indications of casting - 'soft' detail, pitting or tiny hemispheres from trapped air in the casting process, unclear lettering, where the casting material has filled-in spaces in and between letters, and a rough raised ridge around the edge. There is a nice shot of the main types together here http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/17245-ww1-victory-medals-of-the-world/page-5#entry365405 post# 88. Hope this helps, Bill

Hi Martin, Right, firstly the Reissues: Laslo says that the Type 1 is by S Johnson and has less detail than the official type - I believe that the staffa is thicker and the colour is lighter. The type 2 has no designer or maker's names, and there are detail die differences to the official type. Date MCMXIV. The Unofficial: The Type 1 is the Czech-made with smaller Victory. The other types are quite different designs - there are pictures here http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmiles.forumcommunity.net%2F%3Ft%3D49110969 On the Repros: The Type 1 is a cast copy of the S Johnson, made in Britain The Type 2 is a cast copy of the Lorioli & Castelli The Type 3 is a copy of the Czech-made Unofficial type 1 with die variations, the most notable of whichj is the letters at the top of the inscription on the reverse. I posted one in the Italian thread a few months ago. The official Tpe 5 is the standard design with no designer or maker's names and date MCMXV. Hope this helps. Bill

Hi Martin, As far as I know there isn't much fakery of the Italian vics. There were so many issued, and the prices they fetch are so reasonable, that it wouldn't make a lot of sense to fake the common ones. If you get the three makers - Sacchini, S Johnson, and Lorioli & Castelli (long and short), plus the one with no maker's name (but with the Orsolini designer's name) that's a good start. The Czech-made Unofficial variants (with the smaller figure of Victory) are more rare and might get faked. I've seen an Italian one with the exergue blank, which should (according to Laslo) have the date on the reverse as MCMXV-MCMXIII instead of the normal MCMXIV-MCMXIII, but the one I saw had the MCMXIV date, so is suspect. There are some good photos on the Italian Victory Medals thread here http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/49858-italian-victory-medals/page-1 Bill

Hi Gents, I see that Belgian vic on eBay - post #64 on page 4 - sold this morning for $213.50. If it was won by someone posting here maybe we could see close-ups? Bill

HI Oliver, I think that, as Janvier was the name of one of the partners we should use that spelling. There is an article on Janvier here http://medalblog.wordpress.com/2010/12/27/janviers_pantograph/ Bill

Hi Oliver, Many thanks for the information. As there is no LA or R anywhere it looks like it's a type unknown to Laslo! Bill

Hi Gents, The first acqusition of 2013 .... .... a pretty average Official Type 2 US vic .... but named around the whole edge. The name is J STANLEY GORDON U.S. NAVY Q.M. 1st CLASS. There is a tiny C after the U and a tiny G after the S, so I guess he was in the Coast Guard. The engraving is very elegantly done. I know that the Navy regs allowed the recipients to have the medal named at their own expense, but I haven't seen many examples. Please post them if you have them. Any comments welcome. Bill