Jerry B

it is British made and these markings on the sweatband are not precisely dated but late 30's early war is probably correct.

can you show the underside?

Not British as far as I am aware, maybe Belgian or other near Continental

When I clicked on this post earlier it confused me, I only just now realised why, the spelling site as opposed to sight made me think it was about a gun emplacement rather than an optical device.  Auto spelling I assume to blame.

Sorry I can't actually help you.

11 hours ago, Hugh said:

To state the obvious (to British collectors) - the crown appears to be from Victoria's reign, and the three feathers belong to the Prince of Wales.  Couldn't connect the scroll with II to any regiment with Prince of Wales.  So much from the dilettante.  Now let's hear from the experts.  

The crown could also be for QEII.  I assume the II is either for a 2nd Battalion or is for Her Majesty....I also cannot id this to any Prince of Wales regiment.

I assume it is quite small and is more of  a pennant than a "colour"?

On 03/12/2018 at 19:52, Cochrane37787 said:

Jerry B, I would really like to PM you with my dilemma but it wouldn’t let me so I’m guessing I need to be commenting on things first. I think the picture of my family member might be wearing the same cap badge as the young man above with his cap on the table. We are confused because we think it’s welsh of some sorts but he was born and raised in Coatbridge, Scotland. I just don’t want to annoy people by commenting like crazy on here  

 

 

Show us the image and we can try and help you.

12 hours ago, Farkas said:

Hi Jerry

the one below is on Ebay at the moment.

.....I see a FAKE!

* wings wrong

* CARDIFF lettering wrong

* Motto across the top has no gaps

——//——

I’m learning!

thanks for your help....

 

tony

All true, the wrong things become obvious once you can compare to an original.

I can't remember the last time I saw an original for sale

Both look 'new' but with some wear and shiny lugs, both are suspect imo, they just don't look correct.  Are the edges of the backs sharp?

On 22/10/2018 at 00:13, Farkas said:

Hi Gents

fingers crossed for these two...

Only one lug left out of four 

 

I picked these two collar.(thanx Terry) tabs up together... 

Apparently they were found at a closed scrap metal yard ——

Such a difference to this one :

.

So I hope these be genuine and escaped the melting pot!

hope you like Gents

tony

 

 

Sadly they are also copies, the originals have a number of quite different details, note the wings of the dragons for one and the lettering of the CARDIFF at the base, both very different

A fine collection and good to see you on this forum since the airborne insignia forum went down.

Thank you for this.

Respect for them that died so we may live our lives as we choose

On 13/09/2018 at 09:09, Stuka f said:

Hey Jerry, 

good to hear from you and very nice pick up! 

cheers 

Kris

 

Cheers Kris, I don't see much of you online either these days.

Thanks Simon.

A recent pick, it was in very poor condition but is looking somewhat better after I gave it some TLC.  I used  a clothes brush and  a soft damp sponge on it.

The frock is the 1902 pattern, the silver bullion collars were only worn by the 2nd VB up to 1908, the buttons have the Jennens and Co backstamp used up to 1912 with the irregular Welch spelling not officially authorized until c. 1921 but the VB's were notorious in this matter, preferring it to the Welsh spelling favored by the WD at that period.  It has only the sorry remains of its original back flash and I added one I had just for the pics.  It seems to have the extra braid knot on the cuffs seen on the earlier 1882 pattern but other wise is correct for the 1902 pattern, complete with blue cuffs for a royal regiment.  The shoulder boards appear to be missing two rank insignia from each of them, from a Captain I assume or perhaps a Lt Colonel which might expalin the more elaborate cuff braid.  Still researching this point.

I would assume old sweats continued to wear it after the introduction of the p37 battledress uniform, people such as warrant officers and others at base duties perhaps, instructors and the like.  I have seen pics of ti in wear during the war years.

BL Davis covers it on p178-179 (various pics throughout the book)in his masterful work British Army uniforms and insignia of WWII.

As already stated post WWI pattern worn into the 1960's.

A number of units wore the flaming grenade collars without the scroll, including the RWF....you need more info to decide for whom it was badged.

i would think interwars anything is less well studied and KD from the period is likely to be no exception.  period photos exist from the afghan frontier and the tribal areas, perhaps an extensive search might help.  i have seen the occasional KD item from the 30's for sale on dealers sites but mostly just the jackets and not shirts...i have a few undated pics that show them with a short sleeved or rolled up sleeve shirt and one from 1932 showing the RWF in the OR's collarless shirt similar as you suggest to the WWI shirt.

very nice, Herbert Johnsons have always made quality headgear.

3 hours ago, Bayern said:

Gentlemen : Why not 2nd Dragoon Guards ( Queens Bays ) ?

I did consider the bays from the shape of the badge, but not sure if they wore this pattern frock with white collar and cuffs.  I had a look on uniformology and they did seem to wear something similar with white facings. 

I had thought infantry of the line as the ornamental braid is correct for infantry and not for the cavalry as each cavalry regiment had unique braid, 2DG for instance had as shown below.

Thanks for pointing back in the direction of the Bays, I shall undertake further research.

thanks for commenting Peter.

Always likely to be  along shot as to unit id.  As for rank it is officers, 2lt to major I think wore the same.

I am trying to id the regiment of this officers scarlet tunic, I assume late Victorian or early 20th century, in fact it is 1881 to 1902 when it is replaced by the other type I own. 

It is not  a royal regiment as the facings are white, but obviously an officers example but it has some subtle differences on the cuff braid and the rear white piping to one I own to the Welsh.  It has been robbed of its collar badges, shoulder boards and buttons and has no label inside it.  It is badly moth eaten and I don't know what to do with it, just leave it or attempt a restoration as it was thrown in with a job lot of other items I bought.

I would be very grateful if anyone can id the unit from which it originated.

It was very common in WWI for aircrew to die in training accidents, I think about two thirds of all aircrew who died were killed in this way.

I have one as well along with the standard issued type.  Certainly not a modern item.

This type is a copy, though some have argued they are period made private purchase for those who did not get one issued, but that is debated

As I said on the other forum, lovely cap and all correct IMO