Mike K

OK. What I noticed was a hinge and pin which looked authentic, a neat but very small catch, an unusual gold finish and some "lumps" in the chain wreath. See the "lumps" below....

Composite image of hinge/pin/catch....

Reverse...

Hi,

I picked up the following Gold WW1 Marine Wound Badge from a local show a while ago. It was cheap but I was not 100% on authenticity. The hinge and pin looked authentic for WW1 Wound Badges but the finish was a bit strange and there were some problems with obverse detailing. I knew it warranted further investigation and thought it would at least be a good filler if it turned out to be bad.

I'll load some pics first and then continue with my "investigation" in subsequent posts - please hold off with comments for a while!

Regards

Mike K

Obverse....

Hi,

Just a word of caution when bringing S&L needle pins into this discussion. Attached is an image of a WW1 Marine Wound Badge which I understand to have been produces by S&L in the 50s or 60s. The reverse looks OK but the obverse has some serious problems with die deterioration. Note the hinge/pin/catch on this example. These can be bought for 20 or 30 Euro in all grades.

Regards

Mike K

Hi,

The first cross is 100% FAKE - an Eastern European example that flodded the market a few years ago. This one looks like it has the fake curved L/54 mark hiding behind the pin, ABOVE the catch.

As stated above though, the second cross is a known fake (CURRENTLY flooding the market) and the L/56 is probably genuine.

Regards

Mike K

Hi,

I was in the process of replying to this when my computer crashed a week ago. Bob, I'm watching you everywhere and it seems I'm going to have to find other uses for my spanner

Here's a closeup of a well formed AWS mark.

Regards

Mike K

Hi,

I've been away for a week with computer problems - nice thread to come back to!

I've never seen one of these docs in person but there is at least one in reference books (Forman's from memory). They are certainly rare - rarer than the badge and that's saying something!

I can add the following; from research done into LW qualification docs and their numbering systems (bottom left of each doc, pre mid-1944 or so - after which the numbering system ceased), the Flieger-Erinnerungsabzeichen had it's OWN UNIQUE numbering system. All other qualifications (Pilot, PO, Observer, R/O) except the LW Para Badge (also a separate numbering system) used a combined/mixed numbering system. The only other doc I have on record is dated 1 November 1943 and numbered 403/43. 43 = the year of the award & 403 = the total number of badges awarded - as far as I know, this number is from institution in 1936, not the number for the year to date.

Regards

Mike K

Very nice badges, all...

Hi John,

Based on the images in this thread and your comment above, I can only assume that you believe that Juncker had two dies for their Glider Badge eagles?

Regards

Mike K

PS: I'd have PM'd but I don't seem to have that ability on this forum.

blurry scan Reverse...

Hi,

Personally I don't have a problem with Don's example, if only because my own example (which I don't have a problem with - construction or materials) is also made from geschwartz eisen wreath and (bubbled) versilbert zinc attachment with the same hinge/pin/catch! The wreath has distinct shear marks on the edges, even though there are a couple of rough patches on the reverse under the blackening. Making a cast repro of anything in iron would be difficult due to the relatively high temps required. If this type is a repro it is of extremely scary good quality.

I was surprised to hear Rick's comment that he hadn't seen any in iron, as I thought the official title of the award was "Krieger-Ehrenzeichen in EISEN"! Nimmergut's little guides, for what they are worth, list only Iron or Silver examples (blackened and silvered.

Regards

Mike K

My example for comparison;

Hi Jacques,

Interesting. I don't know whether the slash can go the other way, but on the two L/52 boxed stamped markings I have, the slash is a typical "/". Both stamped markings are slightly different though, one on a screwback EK1 and the other on a Silver Wound Badge, so two separate punches were used imo.

Regards

Mike K

and finally the marking - taken/viewed at 4 different angles.

I got onto a serious silver collectors forum and even they could not find a 100% match to the mark. It is almost certainly NOT a swan though. Swan markings were used on some silver imported into France but that swan mark is different. The marking is actually best represented by the top left angle and is most likely a leaping fish/porpoise. There is a similar marking (actually a mirror imaged - ie double - a leaping porpoise but the design of this single porpoise is VERY similar) used by Romania for imported silver items during/just after WW1. All I can think of is that during the German occupation of Bucharest in WW1 a local jeweller imported some EK1s from Germany and marked them with an import stamp similar to those known to have been used at the time.

Regards

Mike K

the reverse of the cross - markings aren't visible but are as indicated.

Hi,

I only just read this thread and saw Jim's reference to his ex-cross.

Following are some blurry pics of the cross but very good images of the unusual marking.

Regards

Mike K

A decent scan makes the EK look a little nicer.

Regards

Mike K

Hi Valsente,

I think your 100 GAB is a fair quality repro. The hinge and catch are not correct (compare carefully to Rick's 75 GAB image) and there appears to be casting "flash" down the entire reverse left hand side of the badge.

Robin, I can only agrre with Rick in that the dark streaking is not wear, is is the finish turning colour (for whateber reason). My own JFS 75 GAB has only one tiny spot where the plating is chipped and the zinc basemetal is exposed, but the gold finish (a relatively thick plating) is dark streaked like Ricks. The plating is basically still 100% present, even in the darker streaked areas.

Regards

Mike K

Hi Rick,

I put such a wide date range on this cross because the same (or very similar) hinges are known from badges as early as 1918/1919 eg, the earliest Stahlhelmbund Dienstreitritt Abzeichen, Freikorps and a plethora of 20s veteran organisations/awards (eg the HCH TIMM Berlin marked Prussian Landeskriegerverband 1 Kl Ehrenzeichen). The hinge of course extended to early/mid WW2, as used on eg Round 3 EK1s and 6/8/10 rivet DKiGs.

Regards

Mike K

cloth hinge

top

3.00

2.00

Hi,

I thought I'd post some pics of a recent arrival - a Prussian 1914EK1 in a halbetui. I don't recall seeing many Imperail halbetuis before, so for me it's of more interest than the cross. For the record, the cross is a 3-piece brass (non-magnetic) indeterminate late-WW1 to earliest 40s example. Following are some pics of the case.

Regards

Mike K

Hi,

Interesting how the eagles in Post#3 and Post#7 are so very different when you look at the details. Atypical Juncker hinge (imo) in Post#8 as well. Food for thought.

Regards

Mike K

Hi Wayne,

That looks like a nice original ball-hinge zinc Flak Badge. Some say unmarked AS (for Adolf Scholze) but I've never seen one of these marked and I know other companies used the ball hinge.

Regards

Mike K